Sifting different kinds of Sand for different resources

[CyberCat05]

Every Rock type in the game has a corresponding kind of Sand (and Gravel), so the implication seems to be that every type of Sand is just a finely ground version of its host Rock. But if that's the case what separates the Lime item you get from grinding Limestone or Chalk in a Quern from the Limestone or Chalk Sands you can find in nature?

I figured the only thing that would make the raw sands unusable is that they'd be dirty, with a bunch of bits of organic matter and unrelated minerals. So I figured, the best way to process them and make them useable is to sift them with a sieve. You could do the process manually like with Panning, or you can make later make a sieve shaking table to automate the process with Mechanical Power.

• Limestone or Chalk Sand would yield 1 Lime per block
• Halite Sand would yield 1 Salt pet block (doesn't currently exist but should as Salt deserts are awesome)
• Claystone Sand would yield 0.5 Red Clay per block on average
• Shale Sand would yield 0.5 Blue Clay per block on average

I do think this is balanced. For Lime, you technically get less Lime per block than you get from Chalk or Limestone, as each block of those drops several stones. For Clays, you get several pieces of clay per Soil deposit, and you don't have to process them first. The Sieve is locked to the Copper Age already, so you won't be able to get clay from them immediately and would still need to find a deposit. It'd just provide a good, reliable yet labor-intensive way to get large quantities of Clay mid-to-late game if you absolutely can't manage to find a deposit near you, which I don't think is too broken since you already get several hundred pieces of Clay per deposit.

Spoiler

Technically Shale or Claystone Sand shouldn't really be able to exist outside of deserts, it would instantly absorb water and turn into clay the moment it got wet, but I'm willing to suspend my disbelief

With the next ones I'm not so sure they should be added since the stuff you would get from them is currently locked behind the Pulverizer.

• Sandstone, Chert or Granite Sand would yield Crushed Quartz
• Peridotite Sand would yield Crushed Olivine
• Bauxite Sand would yield Crushed Bauxite

All of these would technically allow the player to get certain items without Mechanical Power when they wouldn't otherwise be obtainable, Maybe there's a way to balance it that I'm not seeing, but right now I don't think it's balanced.

The one exception is the Silica Sands - I definitely think Glass should be obtaineable through those sands, as that's literally the most well-known use of sand IRL. Maybe instead of sifting them for Crushed Quartz, you could put them directly in a Bloomery for glass, with drawbacks like getting less glass per block and the resulting glass looking dirtier due to impurities. That way you wouldn't be able to get Crushed Quartz - and T1 Refractory Bricks - from Sand while still being able to use it for glass.

[DeanF]

On 8/21/2026 at 8:12 AM, CyberCat05 said:

 But if that's the case what separates the Lime item you get from grinding Limestone or Chalk in a Quern from the Limestone or Chalk Sands you can find in nature?

Fineness.

One "official" definition of sand has particles between 0.074 mm and 4.75 mm.  By another it's 0.0012 cubic mm to 4.2 cubic mm.  But (I assume) for lime to actually dissolve in water it would have to be more fine than that.  And not unsurprisingly, almost every source defines dust as "anything more fine than sand".

If I'm being really persnickety we should have to burn it in a lime kiln, too, not just grind limestone or chalk.  But I guess the game reserves burning for quicklime.

I do like the idea of claystone having higher drops for clay.  That seems both handy and thematically appropriate.  Not sure about shale/blue clay- I just don't know how that relationship works.

Your Pulverizer materials ideas sound logical, but as you said there may be game balance reasons not to do that.

It does seem silly that we cannot somehow make glass from silica sand.  That actually surprised me.

[CyberCat05]

On 8/24/2026 at 9:11 AM, DeanF said:

Fineness.

One "official" definition of sand has particles between 0.074 mm and 4.75 mm.  By another it's 0.0012 cubic mm to 4.2 cubic mm.  But (I assume) for lime to actually dissolve in water it would have to be more fine than that.  And not unsurprisingly, almost every source defines dust as "anything more fine than sand".

If I'm being really persnickety we should have to burn it in a lime kiln, too, not just grind limestone or chalk.  But I guess the game reserves burning for quicklime.

I do like the idea of claystone having higher drops for clay.  That seems both handy and thematically appropriate.  Not sure about shale/blue clay- I just don't know how that relationship works.

Your Pulverizer materials ideas sound logical, but as you said there may be game balance reasons not to do that.

It does seem silly that we cannot somehow make glass from silica sand.  That actually surprised me.

I think that even if we go by the official definition of Sand then this still works 1. This could serve as an additional explanation for why you only get one Lime item per Sand block as you're sifting the finest dust particles out of the larger grained sand, and 2. Regardless, for all the functionality it has in-game and in real life, sand-sized Calcium Carbonate particles would have pretty much identical practical functionality as if they were powder-sized. Even if you fired them into Quicklime they'd react with water to form Slaked Lime just as fast (even if you fired a solid rock of limestone into quicklime it would still react with water and dissolve completely in just a few minutes)

The "Lime" item in the game seems to be unfired finely powdered Calcium Carbonate while Quicklime is fired. The strange thing about it is that you can make Limewater with it when in reality the powder would just sink to the bottom of the water. Limewater IRL is watered-down Slaked Lime.

As for Shale, in real life then yes, it is a type of Mudstone made mostly of clay-sized particles and is actually defined with an identical composition range as Claystone. The difference is not their composition but their structure - Claystone is a mostly homogenous rock with the clay particles all clumped up in random orientations like a traditional rock, while in Shale the Clay particles are aligned into flat layers, making the rock Fissile (easily splits into flat sheets). Functionally that means they'd both just turn into dry clay if you crushed them. The reason my suggestion has them yield different clay colors is as simple as them having different colors in the game, implying those specific varieties of Claystone and Shale are made up of different clay minerals.

I'm sure that in the future if a deeper Glassmaking system is introduced then Sand would be useable in it. Glassmaking in general is more complex than just melting down pure Quartz, in real life doing that requires way higher temperatures than what is achievable in game, so it's always mixed with other materials (traditionally Lime and Soda Ash, sometimes Potash and/or Lead Oxide depending on the desired properties) to lower the melting point and the viscousity of the liquid form, except for some modern applications where pure Quartz glass is specifically needed. I think if a system like that gets introduced that's where the interchangeability of Silica Sand and Crushed Quartz could be included - You'd be able to use either for crafting the glass mixtures, but only Crushed Quartz for Refractory Bricks.

Spoiler

Speaking of which, the "Quartz Glass" in the game kinda makes no sense, I get that it's a way to get Glass early-game but maybe Glass shouldn't be so readily available in the Stone Age, and if you really want it then you can technically make a bloomery in the Stone Age. It's especially weird when the thing called "Quartz Glass" in real life is actually significantly harder to make than normal glass.

 

Edited September 2 by CyberCat05

[Mac Mcleod]

One thing that gets me is I watch Primitive Technology and other channels literally make clay from dirt by putting it in water and letting it settle out.
So there should be a mechanism involving mixing water and dirt to make small amounts of clay.

Here:

"The traditional method is surprisingly simple:

1. Collect the dirt preferably soil from a place where the ground is naturally sticky when wet.
2. Remove large debris pick out rocks, roots, leaves, etc.
3. Mix with lots of water stir the soil thoroughly into a muddy slurry.
4. Let it settle briefly. Heavy sand and gravel sink quickly; the very fine clay particles remain suspended much longer.
5. Pour off the suspended muddy water into another container, leaving the heavier material behind.
6. Let the clay settle in the second container. The clay particles eventually form a fine layer on the bottom.
7. Pour off the clear water.
8. Dry the clay somewhat until it reaches a kneadable consistency.
9. Knead/wedge it to distribute the remaining moisture evenly and remove air.

This is essentially levigation, and it can produce remarkably pure clay from ordinary soil."

[CyberCat05]

22 hours ago, Mac Mcleod said:

One thing that gets me is I watch Primitive Technology and other channels literally make clay from dirt by putting it in water and letting it settle out.
So there should be a mechanism involving mixing water and dirt to make small amounts of clay.

Here:

"The traditional method is surprisingly simple:

1. Collect the dirt preferably soil from a place where the ground is naturally sticky when wet.
2. Remove large debris pick out rocks, roots, leaves, etc.
3. Mix with lots of water stir the soil thoroughly into a muddy slurry.
4. Let it settle briefly. Heavy sand and gravel sink quickly; the very fine clay particles remain suspended much longer.
5. Pour off the suspended muddy water into another container, leaving the heavier material behind.
6. Let the clay settle in the second container. The clay particles eventually form a fine layer on the bottom.
7. Pour off the clear water.
8. Dry the clay somewhat until it reaches a kneadable consistency.
9. Knead/wedge it to distribute the remaining moisture evenly and remove air.

This is essentially levigation, and it can produce remarkably pure clay from ordinary soil."

That really depends on the type of soil, some soils are mostly sand and silt with not much clay. It would be cool if they added different types of soils based on the USDA Soil Textural Triangle like TFC did rather than the vague "Low/Medium/High Fertility Soil" thing we have now.

But that's a whole separate suggestion.

What prompted this is the fact that anything you could call "Claystone Sand" or "Shale Sand" would literally be pretty much pure dry clay

Edited Sunday at 04:41 PM by CyberCat05