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Calendar settings and increasing satiety "capacity" to increase food consumption

Brumes Wolf

By Brumes Wolf
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Brumes Wolf Wolf Bait

Brumes Wolf

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Introduction

I'm looking at playing VS again sometime soon with friends, but have some questions/problems I need to resolve before then.

Last time we played we played with pretty much default settings, except we had 60 minute days, and set the server to stay active even with no one online, this resulted in several years passing during the ~100  hours of our "campaign", which was cool as we got to actually experience seasons and make actual progress with animal husbandry.
A major downside that showed itself was that because we would only be online (and thus consuming food) for a fraction of the simulated time, this meant we very quickly ended up with a pretty big food surplus once we started farming, because we would have a harvest ready almost every time we logged in.

Now I am thinking about what setup to use when we play again, I want to achieve pretty much these goals:

  • Ideally have the server only be active when we are online so we don't have these time jumps we had previously.
  • Maximize the years we experience during our playthrough, at least passing a few years in ~100 hours of playtime.
  • Have seasons/winter last long enough to make them feel meaningful, and ideally see winter seriously eat into food storage.
  • Make food matter, this is difficult given how easy food is to get, but ideally it would remain a moderate concern through the entire playthrough.
  • Days should be long to be able to get stuff done, having to stop "working" to go back home to sleep all the time is annoying.
  • Ideally it should not be required to eat more than a few times per day, because anything more would put a significant "inventory size tax" for all the food you'd have to carry to get through the day.

I can probably deal with most of the time related concerns by doing something like 60 minute days with 3-4 day months, but its the food related things I'm a little stuck on.
AFAIK crops operate on calendar time, so with those settings you would have harvests of longer term crops about every 8 days (similar story for berries, livestock, etc), this seems like it would still lead to getting a pretty big food surplus pretty quickly.

The questions

I think I could fix a bunch of these issues if I could increase the satiety "capacity" of the player, while also increasing their satiety consumption (and doing the same to nutrients), this would increase the amount of food a player needs, without decreasing how long their food bar lasts, resulting in a similar number of meals per day needed, they would just be bigger meals.
I have not been able to find a command for this though, only for increasing food consumption.

  • Does a command/config exist for increasing the players satiety/nutrition capacity?
  • Does nutrition go down over time, or is it purely related to the ratios of food eaten?
  • Is there perhaps other ways to achieve what I am talking about here?

In addition to these questions, I also invite anyone reading this to provide any other input or personal experiences they have that relate to the goals I mentioned above, maybe I should be looking at a completely different direction to achieve what I want, or maybe I want the wrong things from your point of view, please share your thoughts.

LadyWYT Historian

LadyWYT

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Welcome to the forums!

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Ideally have the server only be active when we are online so we don't have these time jumps we had previously.

I think this should be the default setting--time shouldn't pass at all unless someone is online. If it's not the default, I know it's a setting somewhere in the server config, as the friend that hosts the one I play on has time set to not pass unless someone is online.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Maximize the years we experience during our playthrough, at least passing a few years in ~100 hours of playtime.

You'll probably want to shorten month length then, or otherwise look into mods that shorten day length. The typical day in VS is 48 real life minutes long. Of course, you could just sleep through the nights as well--that passes a lot of time.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Have seasons/winter last long enough to make them feel meaningful, and ideally see winter seriously eat into food storage.

This one conflicts with the above...to get seasons to last longer, you need to make the months longer as well. Which means that time will be passing slower and you likely won't see more than a year or two in 100 hours of play.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Make food matter, this is difficult given how easy food is to get, but ideally it would remain a moderate concern through the entire playthrough.

Crop growth scales with day-month setting, to my knowledge, so setting your months to be longer will mean it takes longer for the harvest to come in. That means you'll need to rely on hunting and foraging for longer than normal, and you'll need more food to last through the winter too. However, it's also easy to counter both of those problems by just building bigger farms.

Food isn't really a big issue, as a general rule. If you have your food supply locked down, the rest of the game is pretty straight-forward. That being said, you could try cranking up the hunger and spoilage rates; you'll need more food that way, and the food you have won't last nearly as long.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Days should be long to be able to get stuff done, having to stop "working" to go back home to sleep all the time is annoying.

I think there's at least one mod floating around out there that will let you adjust day length, though I don't recall the name and I'm not sure it's up to date. Keep in mind too that sleeping helps pass the time if you want the years to go by faster. Likewise, shorter days mean that time will pass more quickly, which results in faster years as well, but also shorter, less meaningful seasons.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Ideally it should not be required to eat more than a few times per day, because anything more would put a significant "inventory size tax" for all the food you'd have to carry to get through the day.

Depending on what you're doing, by default you don't really need to eat more than a couple times a day. Eating a full meal from a bowl in one sitting will give a saturation bonus, so you won't get hungry again for a while. If you're away from home doing a lot of work, pies are a better option since they're very filling and easily stackable. For a day's work away from home, a pie or two(depends on filling) should be plenty to keep you going on default settings.

Now if you're packing supplies for spending several days away from your base, that's different. In that case, inventory management is part of the challenge of planning such a trip, and if you don't want to sacrifice extra slots for food, you'll need to plan on hunting, foraging, or some other method of resupplying.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

I think I could fix a bunch of these issues if I could increase the satiety "capacity" of the player, while also increasing their satiety consumption (and doing the same to nutrients), this would increase the amount of food a player needs, without decreasing how long their food bar lasts, resulting in a similar number of meals per day needed, they would just be bigger meals.
I have not been able to find a command for this though, only for increasing food consumption.

You'd need a mod for this. Technically one exists...but it's not yet released.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Does a command/config exist for increasing the players satiety/nutrition capacity?

No, but you can change the hunger rate and the food spoilage rates to be faster or slower. As I mentioned earlier, you could try increasing the hunger rate, so that players need to eat a bit more than they'd need to on default. Keep in mind that doing that also means players will be needing to eat more often as well.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Does nutrition go down over time, or is it purely related to the ratios of food eaten?

Nutrition will decay slowly over time. If you aren't eating a balanced diet, it's easier to notice, since you won't be replenishing certain areas of nutrition at all. Current nutrition is also cut in half when you die.

3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Is there perhaps other ways to achieve what I am talking about here?

Possibly...but as it currently stands, there is not, to my knowledge. At least not yet...I would keep an eye on the database.  As I said before, you'd need a mod to accomplish what you're asking for the hunger, and there's not yet any available that really cover that territory. I will also note that if you are going to be modding a multiplayer server, the hosting needs to support mods, which means third-party hosting since the official servers don't support mods currently.

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Teh Pizza Lady Steel Worker

Teh Pizza Lady

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3 hours ago, Brumes Wolf said:

I think I could fix a bunch of these issues if I could increase the satiety "capacity" of the player, while also increasing their satiety consumption

@LadyWYT and I are working on a mod that let's you do what you just described... as soon as she finishes the artwork, I will be hitting the Publish button on the ModDB!

Brumes Wolf Wolf Bait

Brumes Wolf

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2 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

I think this should be the default setting--time shouldn't pass at all unless someone is online. If it's not the default, I know it's a setting somewhere in the server config, as the friend that hosts the one I play on has time set to not pass unless someone is online.

It is the default setting. I wasn't clear enough in my OP, I changed the setting to have the server run all the time before last time we played, in order to allow us to experience more calendar time.

2 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

You'll probably want to shorten month length then, or otherwise look into mods that shorten day length

Day length can be changed without mods using the "/time calendarspeedmul" command.

2 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

This one conflicts with the above...to get seasons to last longer, you need to make the months longer as well. Which means that time will be passing slower and you likely won't see more than a year or two in 100 hours of play.

Yeah, this is kind of the core conflict I am trying to solve, wanting to both experience meaningful season length, and to also see a decent number of years pass.

2 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

Keep in mind too that sleeping helps pass the time if you want the years to go by faster.

I hadn't thought about sleeping yet, given we tend to sleep every night it would make calendar time go faster in practice than it would appear to go on paper. Thanks for the idea.

2 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

I will also note that if you are going to be modding a multiplayer server, the hosting needs to support mods, which means third-party hosting since the official servers don't support mods currently.

I host my own servers and we already had a bunch of mods running before, so that wont be a problem :).

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Brumes Wolf Wolf Bait

Brumes Wolf

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2 hours ago, traugdor said:

@LadyWYT and I are working on a mod that let's you do what you just described... as soon as she finishes the artwork, I will be hitting the Publish button on the ModDB!

That sounds very useful, I was afraid I was gonna have to figure out how to make one myself if I couldn't find some other way to square this circle.
Is there any ETA when this would approximately be published? And is there a way I can be notified when that happens besides checking the mod DB every so often?

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LadyWYT Historian

LadyWYT

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20 minutes ago, Brumes Wolf said:

Yeah, this is kind of the core conflict I am trying to solve, wanting to both experience meaningful season length, and to also see a decent number of years pass.

21 minutes ago, Brumes Wolf said:

I hadn't thought about sleeping yet, given we tend to sleep every night it would make calendar time go faster in practice than it would appear to go on paper. Thanks for the idea.

Sleeping through nights is probably your best bet, from the sounds of it. That way you can set the month/year lengths to be quite long and have meaningful seasons, but still have time pass relatively quickly since you aren't squeezing every last bit of usable time out of a day.

20 minutes ago, Brumes Wolf said:

That sounds very useful, I was afraid I was gonna have to figure out how to make one myself if I couldn't find some other way to square this circle.
Is there any ETA when this would approximately be published? And is there a way I can be notified when that happens besides checking the mod DB every so often?

Not really, aside from what @traugdor said. He handles the code, while I test and help refine details/make assets. As far as I'm aware, all the pieces are there regarding what the mod does, and I'm pretty sure that we've swatted all the bugs...at least all the ones we could find, so there shouldn't be any major issues on launch. I just need to finish the thumbnail art and it should be ready for a proper release...so, maybe sometime in the next couple of days, I'd guess?

As for getting notified, I can just make a mental note to drop a link here when it's ready. 😛 That way you don't have to go hunt for it.

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Pervy Berry Picker

Pervy

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1 minute ago, traugdor said:

Yes. They were created independently and tested to ensure they could work together.

So what would happend if both were installed? Like does it stack or what does it do, when u have both?
Edit sorry for going off topic.

Edited by Pervy
Teh Pizza Lady Steel Worker

Teh Pizza Lady

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2 hours ago, Pervy said:

So what would happend if both were installed? Like does it stack or what does it do, when u have both?
Edit sorry for going off topic.

lol that's fine!

So if both are installed, you can over eat to gain fat in both mods. My mod's fat can be considered "bad" fat in that building it up will lead to game play changes that I haven't quite spelled out because I want the user to discover them for his or herself. Tasshroom's mod's fat can be considered "good" fat in that building it up will allow the player to go for extended periods of time without food before they begin to starve or take damage from not eating. With some config tweaks you can get both to cooperate and play nicely with each other but that would be a question for @LadyWYT because she did all of the testing for the mod when I was creating it. :) 

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LadyWYT Historian

LadyWYT

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1 hour ago, Pervy said:

So what would happend if both were installed? Like does it stack or what does it do, when u have both?

Both mods play nicely together, but you will probably need to tweak some config values for the best experience. Each mod has its own way of tracking fat and the effects, though both mods have the player gain fat in roughly the same way. So if you're building fat reserves in one, you're likely building fat in the other as well. 

Tasshroom's BodyFat, in my experience, allows a fat reserve that will keep you from starving to death, as long as you still have fat reserves that is. Fat reserves take several days to build up, but will only stave off starvation for a couple of days if you eat absolutely nothing. There is no drawback to having such fat reserves, currently.

With our mod(Expanded Stomach), fat won't keep you from starving to death, but it will insulate you from the cold. Your body will acclimate to your eating habits over time, and you'll experience the benefits or drawbacks that come with said habits. So you can potentially eat more in one sitting and go longer before needing to eat again, withstand cold better, build/replenish nutrition faster, or lose some of your agility/mobility depending on the habits you chose for yourself. The general idea is that you need to figure out what habits to stick to in order to accomplish the results that you want, as it's not really possible to have all the benefits with no drawbacks on the preset difficulties.

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Pervy Berry Picker

Pervy

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19 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

Both mods play nicely together, but you will probably need to tweak some config values for the best experience. Each mod has its own way of tracking fat and the effects, though both mods have the player gain fat in roughly the same way. So if you're building fat reserves in one, you're likely building fat in the other as well. 

Tasshroom's BodyFat, in my experience, allows a fat reserve that will keep you from starving to death, as long as you still have fat reserves that is. Fat reserves take several days to build up, but will only stave off starvation for a couple of days if you eat absolutely nothing. There is no drawback to having such fat reserves, currently.

With our mod(Expanded Stomach), fat won't keep you from starving to death, but it will insulate you from the cold. Your body will acclimate to your eating habits over time, and you'll experience the benefits or drawbacks that come with said habits. So you can potentially eat more in one sitting and go longer before needing to eat again, withstand cold better, build/replenish nutrition faster, or lose some of your agility/mobility depending on the habits you chose for yourself. The general idea is that you need to figure out what habits to stick to in order to accomplish the results that you want, as it's not really possible to have all the benefits with no drawbacks on the preset difficulties.

It seems very well though out, the mod and your reply :D Thank you.
It seems more like how it works in real life, then just a safety net. Your mod seems very applying for how it handles nutrition and weather.

The bad can be reversed yes? I'm not stuck a skeleton or hamster?

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LadyWYT Historian

LadyWYT

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2 minutes ago, Pervy said:

It seems very well though out, the mod and your reply :D Thank you.
It seems more like how it works in real life, then just a safety net. Your mod seems very applying for how it handles nutrition and weather.

The bad can be reversed yes? I'm not stuck a skeleton or hamster?

Correct! And yes, it is possible to reverse course and lose weight if needed. I will note though that it takes time for effects to become noticeable...both good and bad. You won't dig yourself a hole overnight, but if you find that your habits have had undesirable effects then it will also take you some dedicated time and effort to fix it. 

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