ifoz

This is actually a vanilla issue, and while I'm pretty sure the devs know about it, another report wouldn't hurt. I had it happen to a friend of mine while going through the tower on TOPS, and we had to get an admin involved to teleport them back to the ground.

Being able to kick drifters and shivers to deal some damage and knock them back would be funny. Maybe even increase it a little based on what leg armour/boots the player has equipped. I'm just sayin', gives us a reason to have the metalcap boots. So far, it seems like 1.23 is shaping up to be a combat update in some ways - the new armour system, and Redram saying they likely plan to add at least a few new weapons in 1.23 as well. I'm really interested to see how they integrate them, considering it would pretty much necessitate fleshing out combat or damage types in some way.

I mean, you could just have brigandine in the visual style of 'studded leather' without changing the overall appearance or impacting the realism much.

By the way, just a quick question about the new system if that's alright for the topic of this thread. Since there's now plans for all the cool new scrap armours, does that mean that certain clutter items will drop and be used as parts in the process, it'll just be the generic scrap metal item, or there will be special pieces found in ruins specifically for making armour with? Just kind of wondering how modular scrap armour is planned to work, though very excited to see it ingame.

Echoing what LadyWYT said, more colours would be awesome. Even if that's just stuff like being able to colour non-tailored gambeson by throwing it into a barrel of dye. Motley or checkered gambesons would also be fun, having more than one colour. I also think for another set of scrap armour, it would be fun if there was a torso piece made of locust legs that formed a 'ribcage', and a bell for a helmet with eye slits cut out. Very clearly the work of someone making do with what materials they have available. Also, though I already posted it on the Discord version of this thread, I might just put it here as well so it doesn't get buried under a ton of messages; Mockup 'scavenger' set I drew earlier, mainly as an excuse to pitch the idea of a metal mask shaped like a wolf skull. Traders can already wear wolf skulls strapped to their faces, and I just thought it'd look cool. (This version is slightly different from the version I posted on the Discord - I added more of a harness to the metal plates that is implied to go over the shoulders underneath the fur wrap. I just thought that made it look a little better held together). Sidenote, I wonder if the drifter padded layer means that drifters will now drop a unique type of ragged cloth as opposed to flax fibres like they currently do.

From the new devlog post on the Discord, it looks like armour is going to be fully reworked in 1.23, which is really exciting. It also seems like they are moving away from the current armour style of mostly historical medieval armour, and toward a mix of styles that blend historical designs with materials and necessities from VS' world. There's a lot of cool scrap metal armour designs, among other designs themed around enemies/bosses. While the devlog doesn't paint a totally clear picture of how it all works, it seems like each armour slot (head, torso, legs) will be further divided into a padding layer, mid layer, outer layer and decorative layer. The padding is reeds / rags / hide / fur / leather / gambeson, the mid layer is chain / scale / brigandine / lamellar, and the outer layer is plate.

I do also wonder if the eyes have any cultural significance to the traders - we know they have a lot of superstitions and folklore, and eyes are used in a number of real world cultures as a way to ward off evil. Traders actually have multiple eye motifs - the scrap helmet has red eyes above the rim, and one of the trader-specific Nadiyan hoods also has a red eye painted on the back of the head. That Nadiyan hood though is also a colour match for the 'shady' jacket, so it could also be the eyes mark something to do with a sketchier individual. Maybe someone who is fine buying stolen goods?

I always thought it a little bit odd that VS' scale armour is something you wear over the top of chainmail, rather than just being its own standalone armour type. I mean I understand the intent is to have it be a middleground point between chain and plate, but I think the debuffs might be a bit too heavy to feel like it has much use. I think most people probably just craft chain or craft plate, and leave it at that. I think half-plate might be a better choice for a middleground option, and then have scale as its own cheaper set. I can also imagine half-plate theoretically being handy in the world of VS, where attacks are mostly in the form of shivers biting down on you, or bowtorn bolts. Using plate to protect the most vital organs would probably be a good idea, while chain could cover the areas that need more flexibility. It's also why I think brigandine could be given a bit of an upgrade (it is plate armour, after all) and then scale made to fill that niche of the cheaper yet easier to maintain set. While we don't see much new world armour to guage how humanity handles the supernatural threat, the scrap armour traders can wear does provide a bit of an idea. Mostly it looks like it is designed to only protect the vital organs (plate over the heart, metal spine running down the back), with other pieces probably designed to stop shiver bites being as damaging (the legs having strips of metal strapped to them). The helmet is interesting, since the antler-like attachments and the eyes on the rim don't really offer any strategic advantage, but I'd guess are for intimidation. Rust monsters do have a chance to run away when they feel threatened, so maybe that's a valid strategy for defence.

I think the devs mentioned in a recent interview with Mongster that 1.23 might have something to do with armour, and I'd be quite happy if it did considering that as of right now, the armour system feels a bit underbaked in my eyes. The armour system works and does its job somewhat well enough, but I do think hit chance is a bit of a weird inclusion for a game like this. Hit chance workes as a system in something like Morrowind, because they were still kind of figuring out the line between old-school RPG and action gameplay. But in a game with a 3D world and supporting systems for multiple hitboxes per entity, I don't know why armour doesn't function in a more realistic way when the game chooses where you get hit. It's also difficult for the player to figure out this is how the system works, as it is not very inutitive. A drifter can swipe at your heavily armoured ankles, but if you get unlucky, the game might just apply that hit to your unarmoured head and have you take the full force of it. All other possible armour updates aside (armour layering, more slots, making gambeson more necessary) I think one of the most important changes would be doing away with the hit chance system and introducing a more dynamic one. It'd be pretty interesting to see if players would prefer to armour their legs more heavily to help defend against drifter hits, or their torso to better protect against things like bowtorn bolts.

Aside from the craftable ones, there are medallions only sold by traders or found in ruins. The trader ones are: 'full moon', 'scarab', 'cascade' and 'crescent moon'. The ruin ones are all the others: 'forge', 'lake', 'star', 'night sky', 'crown', 'stiletto', 'strand' and 'cross'.

It's strange to me that roof beams cannot be obtained in survival mode - they allow you to circumvent some of the current roof system's shortcomings, and are used extensively in one of the story locations and on some of the trader dwellings. If they just made roof beams obtainable (and somewhat inexpensive) in survival mode, it would give a lot of freedom to builders while a proper roof system could be worked on in the background. They just need a handful of crafting recipes for the roof beams.

VS Roofing is definitely one of those few mods that I hope are just integrated into vanilla, at least in a simplified form. The vanilla roofing blocks are one of the most restrictive parts of building, to the point the new trader structures don't even bother with them and just use creative mode colliders and beams to make nice roofing. If the devs themselves would rather not use the regular roofing blocks, what does that say about them as a feature (I'm mostly being silly, but I do think it's kind of funny how even the devs try to avoid using them in favour of beam roofing).

This honestly has to be my favourite logo redraw so far, I really feel like it really manages to hit all the key elements. The tree, the gears being hidden underneath, the general colour palette, and importantly the 'clock' face still being the dials of a certain important set piece, rather than just a regular clock. I also think the hand-drawn/painted look is a much better fit for VS than bold lines and harsh divides between shades.

I also think glue won't be fully complete until you can properly repair certain clutter items, rather than just be able to pick up their rubble. Ruined chests are one of the main ones to me, since they make no real sense. You cannot use/repair them when they have items inside, and when emptied out they break into 'chest rubble', which can be repaired. Using glue on the rubble of a chest you just shattered a moment ago just gives you the pile of rubble. I don't think it would be particularly game-breaking either, as ruined chests only have the capacity of a reed chest. Being able to glue and use them would be a really nice decorative option.

I usually don't play with glue enabled (instead just being able to pick up clutter without it), but I've been messing around with it recently and the resin-clutter ratio is a bit insane to me. 6 resin gets you enough glue to fully repair one clutter item. This means that if you wanted to collect an aged red banner from a dungeon (comes in three segments, since the top and bottom runners are separate items) you would need 18 resin. For what is essentially one decorative item. It seems a little crazy to me that this is the glue-resin ratio! I think a much better option would be if 6 resin allowed you to fully repair two or three clutter items, but then have the semi-repaired (33%, 66%) states as portions of litres. That way you could still have that risk/reward player choice, while still making glue overall cheaper. Anyway, let me know what you think about glue balance! That's a bit of a strange sentence.

They weren't really knocked back a version, just that expansions to the system were. This ruin is currently the only type of dynamic dungeon in the game, made as both something of a proof of concept, though also something intended to be in the game at this point. We know there are larger expansions planned for them though, in the 1.22._ patch with other shelved 1.22 content as well as in future updates.

While dry grass is the easiest ingredient to acquire for dyes, green cloth still needs to be mordanted first before it can be dyed. Making mordant requires a pulveriser setup, as well as alum, tin or chromite. Blue and brown on the other hand are the only two colours that don't require mordant at all, so can be dyed prior to having mechanical power.

Your best bet would be going into creative mode (/gm c), breaking the gravel, and then switching back to survival mode (/gm s). It's not supposed to be there, just a quirk of unlucky world generation.

The only real ones I can think of that would become imbalanced would potentially be the arctic hunter set - since it's intended as a lategame fur set upgrade that is on par with Tailor's warm sets. Reindeer herder would also become cheaper, but since Tailor now has other sets that use cheaper cloths (brown, blue, white) and are just as warm, that's less of a concern. Still, since mechanical power is needed to make mordant in the first place, I think even if the arctic hunter set was put more firmly into the midgame through being more accessible due to madder, it'd still be gated well enough to keep fur relevant through the earlier parts of the game. Tailor got a bit of a buff in 1.22 with their new winter sets, since stuff like embroidered fur and arctic fisher are just as warm as reindeer herder/arctic hunter, but only require brown and blue cloth. The shirts are the exception, with the embroidered fur shirt needing white (borax-dyed) cloth, and the arctic fisher shirt needing red cloth. Still, a tailor with only linen, pelts, woad and tannin can still get a set comparable to reindeer herder/arctic hunter.

Relating to my previous suggestion about how I thought clothing traders should also purchase dyed cloth, I think madder root would make a lot of sense as an addition to the game. Madder root was used in the real life middle ages as a red dye. Currently, the only way we can get red dye in the game is through finding cinnabar, which is both rare and toxic. Red should probably be a much more common colour of dye than it is currently ingame, with purple cloth becoming the rare/luxury colour in its stead. Irl, madder root can ground up and then dissolved in sulphuric acid (both things we could do ingame, with the quern and sulphuric acid), which leaves behind the red dye that can then be used to colour cloth. This still does need a mordant, so it would be more of a midgame dye, but would be more reliable than finding cinnabar.

I just realised it was a little strange that clothing traders both sold and bought items of clothing. Buying a few items of clothing makes sense, but not buying any sewing supplies at all seems a bit strange to me given they have things like dyed fabric placed around their huts. I think it could be a nice change if clothing traders would buy clothing, as well as sewing supplies. This would give non-tailor players a bit more of an incentive to make some colours of dyed cloth as well, since they could be sold to clothing traders. Blue and brown dyed cloth would sell for the least due to being easiest to acquire and not needing mordant, while red cloth would sell for the most since it's the rarest to acquire and needs mordant. (This also doesn't really make sense - red should probably be easy enough to obtain from something like madder root, while purple cloth should be the rare one, but that's not really the point of this suggestion).

This is a short one, yet remains a tale of doom, despair, and why too much of a good thing can sometimes end up being bad. In the multiple years I have been playing VS for at this point, I have never seen this happen... Until today. "I heard you liked ruins, and I heard you liked translocators, so I put your translocator right in the path of a ruin entrance, and it got deleted".

It could also be interesting if stock lists and prices varied based on how far from general civilisation a trader was. If a treasure hunter is very far out, they'd have a few extra items of stock, and maybe some special offers. On the other hand if they were closer, they'd have less stock and higher prices due to the lack of ruins nearby. Same for something like a building materials trader - out in the wilderness they'd primarily sell planks, raw daub, clay, mudbrick and logs. Closer to civilisation is when they'd start stocking wallpaper, polished stone and coloured ceramic bricks. Clothing traders in the wilds could sell more practical pieces (fur/warm clothes, and some pre-owned ragged pieces on the cheap), while closer to civilisation they'd start selling fancier and embroidered things. The same goes for what they'd buy - traders in the wilderness wouldn't be very picky at all, but a trader closer to a general area of civilisation might request specific types of food, tools or clothing. ------------ Unrelated to the above, but I just have to say this thread has brought up some awesome ideas. I've always been interested with the traders and potential interactions they could theoretically have, and that's only been expedited with their 1.22 makeover!

That does make sense, yeah. I just mentioned ragged clothing because there are a few ragged/tattered trader clothes, but not many made of pelts. There is the leather/bone jacket and the trader fur wrap, but other than that there isn't much pelt/hide clothing for the traders right now. It'd make sense if there was though, especially for survival traders. That and more fur clothes for the cold climate traders. Cold traders can't wear sandals or any footwear with exposed skin, which makes sense, but they can still wear things like short sleeve shirts. There are some trader fur clothes (two types of fur boots, the fur wrap, the fur shirt, the warm vest and the fur vest) but I think that if cold traders were more likely to wear these types of warm clothing, there would probably need to be more so that they could have about equal variation as the other traders.