Crylum

Existing mod: https://mods.vintagestory.at/hardcorewater Have tested this im game, long aquedcut do not seem to be a problem Important question: does is make any sense continuing the dicussion if a mod already exists? Let me know what you think.

Well, VS has a API for Modding, so my uneducated answer would be yes, you technically can overwrite functions and variables. I am not sure about open source though, if I remember correctly only a part of the source code is. Have already used the VS model creator to create draft version for the wider block I had mentioned in my other post about irrigation canals. Creating the required json files and mod folder structures are not very complicated, once you get the hang of it. The VS Model Creater has some minor quirks and concept you have to get used to. Setting up animations is also quite easy. But overall the tool is quite good. My biggest problem is the programming part with C# and OOP concepts. Using the example documented in the VS Wiki I was actually able to implement so of the logic but it took me ages to do so, due to lack of experiences in this topic. dnSpy is a useful tool if you want to get into VS Modding and definitely getting the mod templates form the official VS GitHub

Hi everyone, added most of you comment and ideas to the inital post -> please see new sections: What material can be used to build the Aqueduct? and Problem/Open questions. Feel free to let me know what you think of the additions I made or let me know if I missed something. Also thanks again for putting in the effort so far! Note that I did not yet any informations on the unloaded chunk topic you guys were dicussing, is was already 1:30am and I did not had the energy to summarize it.

@Krougal Fair point, especially if you don't live near a biome where resin is more common.

@Hentai Ninja Yeah, you are right. I had this exact problem multiple times. I traveled thousands of block, no lime. Most of the time I find borax hours before lime, but this might be just a coincidence. I am not entirely sure myself to be honest. You argument is quite strong and lets face it, the majority of players will go with the backpack. I mean one of the first thing player do in a new game is gathering cattail and craft basket to increase inventory space (ignoring food, tool of cause). If we add the aqueduct to early, when other mechanic, like you mentioned could get outcompeted by other more useful rescources/item. Add the to late, the aqueduct feature may become obsolete/irrelevant instead of something you really want to have, like the backpack example. We need to give players a good reason why it is worth investing effort and resources in building an aqueduct. Just "nice to have" is not enough. Ok, if you are playing without the option to move water source, we have a valid reason. A secound on would aesthetics and immersion, but this may only be relevant for certian player groups. @Seyko and many others had the idea to introducea dynamic water cycle with "real" water physics and so on. Water will no longer be just a block you can used infinitely, water will be finite and therefore a resource player need to collect (collection rain, ice, you get the idea). Clay as an alternative to screed/plaster, could be a good substitute. Clay is plentiful and easy to obtain, so I think it is a good compromise, even if it is not 100%ly realistic. Unless we add some kind of glaze which can be added to the fired clay and then you have to fired the glazed clay on more time to get a waterproof canal block. I will will add all you suggestion to the initial post, once I was some time to do so. Thanks a lot for you ideas! Best, Crylum

@NastyFlytrap Oh, thanks a lot for pointing that out, I have adjusted the link

@NastyFlytrap well, while I was playing the game I sometimes thinking about how the dev actual did the programming. The other time I was watering my crop and noticed quite quickly that having a large field can get a bit tidious. I did not know back than that you can enable transport of water using the bucket in the world options and I had build my base far away from any water source (ok, is was like 100-200 block but you get what I mean). I did some research and found out that the buckets was the only way to get water (ok, you could use the bowl and jug, which is even less efficient) and I noticed that many people were having the same problem. Based on this problem, I did some brainstorming and created the HUB thread. Main idea was to see how many people would like to have this and if enough joined the discussion maybe the VS dev will see it as well.

@Xenomorphilo Just found you suggestion and I think your suggestion pretty much alignes with feedback I got from the community. I am working on creating an overview page disucssing water mechanics: I have also added you post here to make sure it is not lost.

Small status update: look through the VS forum, gathering post and thread discussing water related topic and adding them here: New water mechancis - community suggestions Started looking into modding/API and how to actual implement the water mechanic mentioned: Extending water mechanics - Wiers & Irrigation furrows/ditches Note: I am not a software developer and I have a full time job,so I will only be able to work on this after work/weekend, so I cannot give any promises, that this will ever reach the light of day. But I will definitely give it a try.

Hey, just leaving a comment here to interconnect this post with my post: https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/16374-hub-water-mechanics-overhaul-farm-irrigation-sail-boat-canals-pipes-aqueducts-and-natual-occuring-water-sources/ https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/16498-new-water-mechancis-community-suggestions I am planning to set to a separate thread (maybe "tweak/problems with current water mechanic") summarizing the problems you have mentioned

Hi @SongOfRuth @redram @dot I found you this post while doing some research on new idead and problems related to in game water mechanics. I am have created this thread (see link below), it lists and dicusses different community suggestions (how to enhance/add new features to the current water mechanics)

Hi @bj0rn, I am trying to gather up posts/suggestion related to water mechanics, you might want to check out I have also added you post to one of my overview list, to make sure we keep track of all the ideas:

Hi @citrushook@ShnitzelKiller@egorvsv I know it a bit later but anyway, there is a discord chat discussing more "realistic" water physics called Finite Fluid Development. One of the members even created a quick in game demo Also I had created a Hub thread in the VS Forum, with the aim to summarize water related mechnics:

@MagpieOAO ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣤⣤⣀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠸⣿⣿⣿⣷⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣧⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⡟⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣰⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⣶⣶⣶⣤⣤⣀⡀⠀⠀ ⠀⣀⣀⣀⣀⡀⠀⢀⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡆⠀ ⢰⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣅⠀ ⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠄ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠋⠀ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠀⠀ ⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡟⠋⠀⠀ ⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⡇⠀⠀⠙⠿⠿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡿⠿⠃⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠛⠛⠛⠛⠃⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Status update: *wier metal frame and wooden crossbar, barrier and ajdustment mechanics will follow soon DONE: block/shape need to be importent in game set block orientation based on player view direction shape node tree got simplified IN PROGRESS: implement water overflow protection wier (siphon wier) TODO: [Prio 4] Item behavior and crafting recipe [Prio 4] Block variants (allow other metals or wood in crafting?) [Prio 3] Implement animations and allow player to manually set the water level height (no sure how to do that) [Prio 1] write code which interacts with current in game water mechanics (no sure how to do that, had a look the the API/ documentation and everything looks like rocket sience to me.) TBD: Create all possible wier orientations (blocks), if no better solution is found ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀

@Thorfinn I have been looking onto how modding for VS works. Process is slow as it is a ton of new stuff I have never seen before (I also had to play hide and seek a couple of time with missing "," in my JSON file, which drove me insane) . But I was able to add one new block to the game, eventually. Also I have been working on the adjustable wier "block/shape"concept: Open tasks: Animation are still missing and the node tree needs to be simplified. Shape need to be importent in game Item behavior and crafting recipe Block variants (allow other metals or wood in crafting?) Create all possible orientations, if not better solution is found

@7embre I think that you and anyone who has left a comment helped out a lot. Pointing out edge cases, raising concens (performance, potential exploits etc.) or suggesting idea I had completly overlook myself. It ensures that all idea make sense and stay interconnected with each other.

@Seyko Great thanks, I have added you page to the overview above. Please see section: [COMPLEX] Advanced water physics > Developing "Advanced Hydrodynamics"

For Context This thread is used to track ideas regarding water mechanics (water wheels, wells, spring etc.) suggested by the VS community, which currently do not have a separate topics in our HUB thread If you have an idea (related to water mechnics or items), which are not yet mentioned below, please feel free to add a comment. I will add you suggestion to the overview list. Also see discord chat ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ References A lot of the ideas listed below where taken form the following posts: @Echo Weaver Digging a well: An alternative to moving water source blocks @Porkbrick Water mechanics brainstorm @Nootman Complex Irrigation Systems (And Other Farming Doodads) discusses multiple different ancient irrigation methods * any suggestions or thread/post I missed? Please let me know, so that I can add them here (please see Limitations for suggestions above section before you do) Other post/thread I had found, related to water mechanics More realistic fluid physics. posted by @citrushook Liquid source transport by Buckets posted by @bj0rn Multi Block structures? large volume fluid storage [Archived/discontinued] @MICHAEL CAMPBELL@TheishiopianHi, I found you old post (from 2019) while doing some research on community suggestions on water mechanics and I wanted to add it here to make sure you idea is not lost. Any liquid transfer at less than a bucketful? Make water fill air blocks under itself suggested by @NastyFlytrap Water purification suggested by @RTFM Realistic Water and Thirst suggested by @Xenomorphilo ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Topic overview/features suggestion # Rivers and erosion mechanic suggested by @Porkbrick Erosion: Your dirt hut would eventually wash away in the rain if you didn’t put a roof on it! untilled soil next to moving water could turn into muddy gravel Moving water could also affect soil stability. Banks 2 or more blocks tall next to flowing water would destabilize. Post: https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/13151-water-mechanics-brainstorm/ Rivers: Rivergen mod - https://mods.vintagestory.at/rivergen ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ # Complex water collection system suggested by multiple members Flumes Rain gutter and pipes Reservoirs (use barrels, bucket to catch rain) Water tower Can be manually filled or connected to an aqueduct or natural water source. Water inside the tower reservoirs (is finite and) can be moved around using pipes/wooden chutes (like they have in japan, made out of bamboo. Or hollow out logs maybe?) large tanks for liquids suggested by @MICHAEL CAMPBELL Cistern Dams Wells https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/16420-digging-a-well-an-alternative-to-moving-water-source-blocks/#findComment-78707 Posts: https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/13151-water-mechanics-brainstorm/ https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/16420-digging-a-well-an-alternative-to-moving-water-source-blocks/#findComment-78043 https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/13151-water-mechanics-brainstorm/#findComment-58332 https://www.vintagestory.at/forums/topic/16420-digging-a-well-an-alternative-to-moving-water-source-blocks/#findComment-77964 ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ # Water wheel and pumps suggested by @Porkbrick Windmill powered pumps Water wheel (water reservoirs could be used to power them - water sources need to be finite otherwise you could build an inifite power source, community is working on this) ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

@7embre Will definitly do that That would be awesome. I (and most likely everyone else) would be very curious to hear what you think about it

@Seyko So, I am planning to do some concept update in the HUB thread (clear up) Your "advanced hydrodynamics" system concept very complex and in my option deserves dedicate place to dicuss the idea. I have also found some new edge cases, I would like to discuss with you and I maybe found a good way to improve parts of my suggests using your advanced hydrodynamics concept. Would it be all right with you if we could create separate thread, copy over all your suggestions/comments regarding the "advanced hydrodynamics" to it and post the link to the page, so that I can add it in my inital post (HUB)? If you create the page, this would make sure you have full control of the page. Unless you are fine if I copying your suggestions and create the thread myself. Let me know what you think about it.

@pizza2004 Absolutely, Seyko and I had already discussed this and had come to the conclusion that we definitely needed someone with expertise in this area to check the feasibility.

@7embre thanks for posting the link, will check it out once I have some time. You think it might be worth posting a comment in the discord?

@LadyWYT Thanks, I really try my best to only add new blocks if there are really needed, reuse the same water mechnic for multiple setup (like I had mentioned above: aqueduct and irrigation ditches share the same water mechanic) or add new ways to reuse already existing items, copper chute as water pipes (ok, this was not my idea to be fair, @Never Jhonsen had this idea). My idea was to have a bundle of interconnected water features, which do not required huge amount of changes in code (at least I hope so) as I am pretty sure the dev already have tons of other thing that need to be implemented, tested, bug fixed and polished.

@majestik Exactly, thanks for pointing that out I totally forgot to add this. I will add your commet to the inital post. Preferably yes, I have another thread for this Natual occuring water sources

@Seyko No, no your explaination made perfect sense, I just misunderstood it the first time. Had to read it a second time but then it finally clicked (English is not my mother tongue). Excellent idea, it would ensure that anyone, who would like to stick with the current mechanic can just disable the "advanced hydrodynamics" option. "make yourself a well" only works however if someone has the required knowledge to implement it. I would like to be able to create a mod and turn this ideas into an real thing, but I simple lack the skills and knowlege to do so myself. If it comes to the roadmap, I think we are not perfectly aligned, but some of our suggestion definitly intersect with it (Steam power - pipes | water wheel - aqueduct). I already did it in some cases, but yeah sure. It definitely could not hurt to do so. I have heard of the game but did not play it. Would you recommend playing it? I would be interested to learn how this could potential work in details: Are we talking about pure % 0-100?, using 1 byte to store the % or 0 - 255, therefore 255 = 100%, 127 = 50%, you get the picture. Or what about the water/charcoal level idea. A full block has a height of 16 sub-block (if you use the chisel with smallest size). Normal no flowing water source blocks in game are 14 sub-block. flowing water reduces it height by 2 for each level.