Rainbow Fresh

And that is exactly why I am opening discussion to ask for opinions. It makes absolute logical sense that the world keeps turning when you log out. In the same vein, however, if sticking with what makes "logical sense", it doesn't make sense that you just blip out of existence for a certain amount of time. On the one hand I wouldn't want to force everyone to adjust to my playtime schedule. On the other hand, constantly being pressurend into playing as much as possible when others do aswell (which would be hard across global timezones) sounds like no long term fun time. My conclusion would be that Vintage Story is simply no Multiplayer Game (organized Coop at best). But considering there seems to be 24/7 dedicated public/official? servers people seem to disagree. That's what I'm curios about.

I know it says question in the title and is still not in the "Questions" forum but that is because I am more asking for opinions than actual right answers to a question about the game. No, my question is on an abstract level - how is public multiplayer supposed to work? Granted, this question is coming from Mr. "Only played Singleplayer" so if the answer is something very obvious that was thought of in the game's development already I'll excuse myself. But the story is that this Mr. Singleplayer has some friends who are considering to host a small little community server for us (and some interested others) to play together on. Community server meaning it's not the typical "Hey, anyone got time? I'mma boot the server then" but your average 24/7 dedicated server. And that got me thinking. How is that supposed to work on an increasing scale? If you got a friend, maybe two, to play with and some decency/coordination in when to play even on a 24/7 server (considering time is stopped when nobody is connected afaik) there is no issue. You usually all play together at the same time. Even with more friends and some less "all together or not at all" playing rules, as long as you stick together as one in-game community everything is fine; whoever wasn't on for a bit gets the resources (food) prepared by the ones that were. But all of this falls apart when thinking about a big server with split communites, where not everyone lives/works together. Time is a very, very crucial resource in Vintage Story. Crops grow - and die, food rots. Seasons change making the acquisition for more food potentially harder to "impossible". So if a server is on 24/7 and people mostly always play somewhere on it (global timezones baby), even just having to go to bed for the day and getting a comfortable 8h of snooze before the next gaming session can mean that months have passed in-game. Now you come back and your less preserved food have rotted. Nobody tended to your crops so they dipped past their ripe stage and into damaging weather, reducing the harvest. And this potentially every day. How is one supposed to play like that? And while this is under the half-knowing assumption that most things in-game process their time even when unloaded in-between, even if that wasn't the case and a logged out player's area was unloaded and hence untouched (a very exploitable mechanic), unless you building your base 200k blocks away from other players surely one will walk into simulation distance every now and then - with more or less friendly intentions.

While I partially agree that some things could be expanded on in usability (from what I read on the wiki, the only reason bowl contents cannot be put into any other container anymore is indeed a discussable code limitation), I also want to share my personal favorite easy fix for most any issue in the game where a missing mechanic results in unnecessary losses: /time stop /gm c Delete mis-crafted/mis-placed item Spawn in OG source materials /gm s /time resume

Considering the unique re-spawning mechanics of mushrooms I am not 100% sure, but generally speaking, having vastly explored is a disadvantage for you here as all the new world generation stuff (new structures, new rock strata, new terrain, new berry bushes and plants) only spawn in newly generated terrain, so you will have to walk further out than those 10k blocks you already explored. EDIT: Well, or you could always world edit re-generated terrain outside of a save radius from your home...

Having a much more limited stone age tier of pickaxe could be an interesting idea, even though I personally don't see any immediate use. However if you are saying it requires antler - as in, the stuff grown bucks drop when hunted? - that kinda negates the path of progression. Hunting fast game like deer is basically tied to having access to bows and arrows of decent quality. Lest you play as Hunter class or with disabled class-only recipes, getting a bow takes a while; depending on luck and priorities, longer than it takes to get your first copper pickaxe. So by the time you may even get the "stone age" pickaxe you already made it obsolete.

I agree there should be an unconstestable safe-zone around the player if only to avoid unavoidable insta-damage from unlucky spawns specifically during temporal storms - but I also still second the idea of just making valid rooms spawn proof. In general, even during temporal storms. Building a room is harder and more limited than just spawn-proofing an entire area with un-spawnable blocks (as one could do in older versions with slabs or pebbles) and is a more conscious effort. Pair that with a system that tracks native cave areas so one can't just place down occasional walls in a cave to make it spawn-proof rooms while a house's cellar remains safe and it makes for a rewarding system of "earned safety". If one want's to "cheese" monster spawning in total they'd be much better and easier off turning off monsters entirely while at the same time allowing the player to earn a save space by building a home. And since many if not most players value asthetics in these kinds of games, making your entire base just "rooms" is usually a bad idea, and the limited room size makes impressive builds harder to begin with so only some select options are actually save spaces.

I do agree with LadyWYT that generally just making every single block in the game a time consuming process and tool challenge to place would be overkill. It could make for a fun extra hardcore challenge and hence could be an interesting overhaul mod concept but certainly not a base game mechanic. There already are some blocks, as mentioned, that have involved multi-step processes to place/finish and having some more of those would be nice (the VS Roofing mod I use also turns playing roof blocks into atleast a three-step process with the reward of much, much nicer looking roofs) but replacing the iconic block game mechanics would most likely be a case of "realism over enjoyable gameplay". The game is already hard, time consuming and unforgiving enough in many other aspects that I want to atleast be able to build like a normal Minecraft player in the calm moments I get to enjoy. However, I can also see merit in the complaints you brought up which warrant their own discussion. Mainly, being able to solve your (probably monster or hostile animal-based) problems by just placing blocks. As in, pillaring up to escape any situation or walling off cave sections full of enemies. While not an easy fix like this what I think could be an easy enough approach to mitigate this would be two simple difficulty options; For one, the inability to place blocks while in the air, disallowing pillaring up. Voluntarily combine that with enabled gravity even for soil and now you are forced to staircase up (which monsters can follow you with) with atleast stone materials, which are harder and more deliberate to obtain or limited to just building up natural walls that only need you to gap a block here and there. The second one being the dreaded mechanic of monster being able to break blocks. In this case, I'd say specifically player-placed blocks of below copper tier, meaning you need to deliberately obtain and bring placeable blocks of higher quality to protect yourself instead of just placing dirt. That would also have big challenge implications for building a base.

You mean, like, taking dye you created in a barrel and being able to pour it out into the world (assuming creating water sources from buckets is enabled)?

I disagree, at least for the earlier game stages (that I am currently in) and especially considering that animal spawns in winter have now been fixed to be lower(/disabled?) during winter in 1.22. Further more, the Buthery mod does not necessarily make it more efficient (bar the potential, small 20% increase in potential drops in later stages, though at that point you probably have enough crops to last 3 winters on them alone per harvest), it adds extra steps to even get to the meat. Instead of killing, chopping and then immediately cooking the animal you have to haul it all the way back home, put it on the hook, skin it, wait for it to bleed out, then haul it to the butchering table and chop it up. Extra steps that don't feel wrong imo but are certainly not making things more efficient; in fact, they can be a dangerous game-changer when you are on on your last hunger bar segment and waiting for the darn pig to finish bleeding out so you can harvst it's, like, 3 pieces of meat to last another day in winter. And Blood Trails; granted, as I said before, as much of a nice mechanic I think it is (and hence using the mod) it doesn't do nearly enough right now. Living in very grassy plains, even with a blood trail barely visible between all the grass spotting the deer lying down in tall grass to be virtually invisible before spooking it away by getting too close is not any more possible and in my experience the trail always stops spawning particles (darn magically healing wounds) before the animal even stops running. I don't think (but also don't know for sure as I skipped vanilla skeps immediately for the "From Golden Combs" re-usable alternative) bee stuff is getting increased. You just get nicer looking, less tedious and more realistic alternatives. In the case of From Golden Combs you still need the normal reed skep to acquire your first bees. And as you said even by vanilla standards, crafting skeps is not a limiting factor. But then instead of constantly having to break the entire darn thing and piss off the bees like a peasant while waiting in-between for them to migrate to a new skep, you can just harvest the honey and leave the hive intact. With the high tier La-something apiary being the good looking modern variant of it that is scalable. More expensively scalable than just plopping a million skeps everywhere. So I think it's not affecting the bee economy much, it just offers something more to do and some more QoL scalability than constantly crafting skeps and running for your life after each harvest. Though tying the whole honey production to flower stats would also be a nice touch. I would love to see a more free-style cooking system. I get the implementation ease of just having four slots with the balanced amount of ingridients being a cleanly scaled version of the recipe, which is defined by one driving ingredient - but it would be much nicer if you could just throw things in the pot and see what happens. Servings amount is then determined by the combined "value"/mass of ingredients, just like resulting nutrition values can be relatively scaled.

While your walking stick argument may seem convincing (don't have the mod in question to judge), for butchering the variety of tools makes sense. There are three components to the mechanics of the mod, which are the hook for skinning (step 1), the butchering table for butchering (step 2) and the smoking rack for preservation (optional step 3). More detailed and realistic than vanilla currently is while not being bloated by any means. These then come in three tiers of gear - three "variants"; primitive, normal (copper age), advanced (bronze/iron? age) changing the amount of results gotten from "less than intended" in the primitive stages and "more than intended" in the latest stage. This adds worthwhile progression as you unlock the right to gain more for less work by progressing the game and investing more valuable resources. Essentially the same smithing a bronze falx over a copper one does, which is an unnecessary (technically) but rewarding upgrade to a plain wooden club. You can live with just the club just fine, but it's much easier and comfortable to have a proper high tier sword. The remaining "5 variants of hooks" would guaranteed remain in any vanilla implementation of something like this, because vanilla has variants of all metal object for all supported metal variants. So despite the bronze hook giving 120% drops despite the base material, it will still have visually distinct "variants" for tin bronze, black bronze and bismuth bronze to be made out of. And as for the variety of additional items added; while I do not, personally, see any real reason for the prime meat to exist (it always drops too few to consider using in soups/stews/whatever), too few and too unnecessary to turn into fat and not that much more satiating to be worth cooking individually (hey, free rot for compost I guess!), the rest does make sense. As I happily agree with others' opinions that the game "needs more food variety". So having at least properly made sausages makes sense. Being able to make more stuff out of bone makes sense. The sinew as alternative for some flax recipes makes sense for harsher, more plant-unfriendly areas where hunting hyenas is the primary source of food. Do we specifically need blood as a resource? No. That I agree with. But it's equally not as if the Butchering mod is too bloated either. See, and that's why the discussion of "mods that should be vanilla" is such a complex one. It could very well be that the mod is great - again, don't have it and don't know how exactly it works as it has no explanations outside of the game. But I equally never saw the need for it - and I, too, have a couple mods I wouldn't want to play without anymore. That I deliberately did not mention here, because a cool mod is not equal to something the vanilla game needs. Player's needs vary from person to person, and that's why mods are great to customize that experience to your personal needs. I, personally, do not see the need for the stone quarry mod and hence disagree with you saying it's a game changer and necessary. The vanilla game has a sufficiently functioning and logical way to get stones and rocks. It creates a sense of value where stone path roads are not only beneficial but also something you earn by mining lots of rocks. In my world I built my first house using some cobble, some ashlar bricks for fancy accents and mostly wood and clay shingle roofing. It looks nice (to me) and didn't take tens of hours. It took until the copper age for saws just like I'd heavily expect the quarry mod to require copper age for metal tools. But after that, easy enough. And what few ashlar bricks I decided to use so far for subsequent builds gave me enough pebbles to expand my roads in tandem. And while 4k block roads might sound nice as a long term goal, by that point you literally got nothing better to do and don't need even faster mining mods. So while it might be a great mod for people who think like you, I don't see it being a necessity to add to the game anytime soon. It has a system that works, and having a vanilla-friendly quarry system would certainly require a ton of work and deviations from how the mod solves things.

It did not go yet, and probably won't for a while, cause about 95% of my mods aren't adapted for 1.22 stable.

New, very technical question I got while reading around other random topics: I haven't used one yet but considering being sent thousands of blocks away via translocator without a way to go back would be a death sentence and people had no real reason to use them, so I'm gonna assume translocators come in linked pairs. The question would then be - assuming I use a translocator but then, once updating to 1.22 wipe all generated chunk data outside of a specific radius (to keep new 1.22 world gen close-ish), which would wipe only the destination area of a translocator I have wandered through (I haven't yet, been holding back on using one for this very reason), would that break things? EDIT: Welp, no need to find out anymore. Just gotta hope for... 21 mods to update and wait for about another 30 to stabilize on 1.22 stable.

I am pretty sure they are lamenting the loss of a world with various different stones (potentially including the more useful ones) and complaining about their current world being like mine - Granite, all the way, all the time. Not the other way around.

As much as I, an avid singleplayer enjoyer, love me an alive world with mindless NPC minions to command (and am now, thanks to LadyWYT's comment, looking ever forward to VS Village once updated for stable 1.22) - that sounds like a completely different game. Both to what Vintage Story is now, and what I see as the direction it is further trying to go. So good for mods like VS Village showcasing that it is possible, even with current tech, but really not something I see fitting for the base game itself neither as content nor as horrendous workload for the devs.

I may not be affected by this as I am neither making content out of the game, nor consuming the content other streamers make out of it (and I am also well-versed and quick on the draw when it comes to "fixing" things via commands) and as such have a more blunt opinion on it, but I really don't see a point to limit a mostly asthetic, partially helpful and fully RNG mechanic for the sake of some content creator's video not looking nicer. Logically speaking, monsters are dangerous and hindering. They spawn in early when you have literally nothing to defend yourself, let alone fight back, you are pretty much barred from making any positive game progress. Hence, having a grace period on monster spawns (afaik extended in 1.22 to hostile animals aswell?) makes sense. Rain is a weather effect. It does not harm you, it does not kill you, it does not stop you from doing anything. Worst it can do is make the beautiful environment and lighting shaders look not as nice. On the other hand, rain helps greatly growing earliest game crops, before you can even afford to make a watering can. Limiting rainfall to only be allowed to start after, say, day 5 means you have 5 days in which you are physically unable to grow food, which you need sooner rather than later, lest you already found, formed and cooked clay. Which I don't necessarily expect the average first time player to do, or if they do, not spend it on a watering can. (I sure underestimated farming and food prep in my first year...) I, too, in my first year of the game living near spawn in a temperate, "very common rainfall" area has nearly constant rain. Couldn't see the sun to judge the time of the day for most parts, got annoyed when the 5 minutes of clear skies turned into downfall again. But it never stopped me from doing anything. And I knew that it is also partially my fault for living in a "very common rainfall" area. If it really bothered me that much, I could just move to more arid regions. Head south not care about the harshness of winter. My base wasn't really far developed back then. But the area was nice so the rain couldn't bother me enough to move. Now I am in my second year and all I want is some rain, which hasn't fallen since the snow melted, so I don't have to water my crops every second day and can afford to go venture out a bit further again.