Blaiyze

I was excited to see the firepit change in the changelog, as I too have been using a firepit mod. Alas, burn rate is a bit too fast IMO so I usually manually edit how long firewood for ex burns. It's very likely that this will change further, especially once the status effect system is up and running. Personally, I'm intrigued if the status effect system will impact actually heating indoors via firepit/other heat sources. If that's the case, burn length will likely have to be adjusted to prevent players from having to clearcut an entire forest for fuel for winter.

The latest release, 1.22 rc is an unstable release, which means there will be issues/bugs/glitches/performance problems.

Using AI to try to explain your thought process is intellectually lazy - and it failed to give you a proper example. That is what is called, ironic. You comment like Jordan Peterson, picking apart meanings of words to bring the discussion into an alligator deathroll of nonsense. Insisting your perspective is the only correct or valid one on a topic as subjective as enjoyment from playing a video game, rather than actually engage in the topic being discussed, is what some would consider trolling. It's the argumentative equivalent of fighting windmills a la Don Quixote; it doesn't provide any substance, and doesn't bring the conversation forward.

Truthfully, the main reason for my using the Primitive Survival mod, was for fishing. Especially with adjustments to the berry bushes - which I like on the surface (still haven't played 1.22 as I prefer to wait for stable versions before jumping in), given berries were the cheesiest part of the game and weren't as intricate as other things. Honestly, I prefer simplistic fishing mechanics - too many games jump too hard into mini-game mode and it becomes cumbersome after a while. I don't know how many VS players play solo, my assumption would be a fair amount of us, and if that's the case, I definitely don't see the point in over complicating fishing - all the systems are already intricate and relatively time consuming to some degree to the point that you have to focus on organizing your days potentially around doing one or two things. In short, I'm looking forward to checking out fishing in 1.22 and potentially removing a mod from my already extensive mod list.

Honestly, I've always read your responses as someone who deeply enjoys and cares about this game - as I'm sure majority of us do - and we WANT to see this game not only continue development and eventually finish, we want to see the development be good rather than go down some of the disaster pipelines other games have gone. I make a deliberate point to not play the pre and rc releases because I understand that new features may well be underbaked, so I'll withhold harsh criticism until the release is fully stabilized and then give opinions. Overall I like where VS is going and enjoy the community here. I also typically avoid discord because it's very impulsive and divisive.

Generally yes, respectful environment by way forums go - which is impressive as many forums have full on imploded over the years due to user generated drama or bs. I've been here about 3 years but have mostly been a quiet lurker until the last while. My general rule: the internet is awash with highly opinionated folks, a$$hats, trolls, and people just looking for outlets because they don't have a better way of processing things, so they act like an anonymous d!ck online. Simple answer: don't feed the trolls. It usually becomes apparent very quickly, within a couple messages or so, when someone is arguing in bad faith or otherwise just trying to get a rise out of you. When you recognize that that's what is happening - stop engaging. In short, don't feed the trolls. They will eventually either see themselves out because no one is taking the bait, or they'll just become quiet. Even when someone tries to make a debate personal, it's our choice how we decide to feel about it and especially, how we choose to respond about it. Don't let people under your skin, they're not paying your bills or living your life, ergo they're not worth the wasted energy. Otherwise, I really enjoy hearing the various perspectives from people on this forum; there's fantastic feedback and discussions about a wide variety of features, mechanics, and goofy stories, and ultimately, that's what I love about this community. Stepping up moderation could perhaps wrangle the outliers a bit, reminding them that this isn't exactly an anonymous free zone to be an unmitigated lint ball over things - but that's up to the dev team.

I already play with a sleep mod lol, realy makes me think more carefully and strategize my daily activities and movements rather than just full sending.

Oop must have missed that lol

That's why I mentioned handicaps - reduced output etc. Just because you have access to something earlier doesn't inherently mean it's easier, it just gives you an option to access it. Presently, it makes no sense that leatherworking is gatekept behind copper.

I was just spitballing numbers off the top of my head. IMO it would make sense for Temporal Storms to have a heavy impact on our stability, to have stability fluctuate wildly at first, potentially dropping stability below the spawn threshold long enough for a couple monsters to pop in, and fluctuate higher again, thus players that want to fight don't have to wait too long, and players that prefer not to fight are incentivised to craft the thing/whatever to stabilize the fluctuation quickly. Iunno, tossing ideas. Someone else mentioned more wonkyness with like, ghosts of monsters/creatures that appear and flicker in and out of existence, just to add to the existential dread during the storms and I think that's a brilliant concept - but have no clue if that's even possible to do.

I'm still not sure why the devs haven't ever considered tannin - easiest no-brainer for early game leatherworking. We can already debark logs, let us collect the bark and make tannin from it. I play with the Ancient Tools mod which is one of my favs and has easily become a must-have mod for me. It allows us to create an early game barrel out of a log, at the handicap of it not being as efficient/able to hold as much as a proper barrel, has to be sealed wither either pitch or fat, and we can collect bark from logs we've stripped to soak in water and make tannin. It also adds brain tanning but I can understand if the devs don't want to go in that direction. But ultimately I agree, gatekeeping leatherworking behind lime, something that we need to at least be in the copper era to be able to utilize, yet several of the leatherworking recipes would be -very- useful for early game hunter+gathering/nomadic playstyles. It doesn't make sense. Make it less efficient, that's fine, but we need to be able to do some leatherworking earlier on.

This is exactly why I play with worldgen mods - I've tried several river mods and I gotta say I love traveling via raft being nomadic for the first while just exploring. The Watersheds mod is absolutely gorgeous and creates really beautiful areas, I just wish they would design their rivers to run greater distances so that river travel would be more likely. At this point, Watersheds has been added to my list of personally absolutely necessary mods. Been testing out TerraPrety and yeah, I'm hooked lol. I think it's fair to say that Worldgen could definitely use a bit of TLC to further distinguish it from that other block game. Really looking forward to the future of status effects which will really up the ante and I'm hoping, make it so we can actually heat our homes with our campfires. It's kind of odd atm to be sleeping next to a roaring firepit but the temperature indoors is only registering the same as the ambient temp outdoors.

Stop engaging with them. If you've read this entire thread, you'll see that they just enjoy arguing for the sake of arguing.

No, because then it would be 7dtd, not Vintage Story. The issue with TS's with how they've been designed at the moment, is there's no reason to engage with the storms - that doesn't mean they should become a siege event. The only reason people are assuming they're some form of weirdly programmed siege event, is because of how poorly they've been implemented. Someone else mentioned a good solution earlier: Tie-in temporal stability to the storms - the longer the storm rages, the lower your stability becomes, but give the player the ability to increase their stability. We can already do this by killing enemies, but there should be another way to do it for the people who don't wish to fight, but has a bit of a handicap compared to fighting. Should your stability stay above say 80%, no enemies spawn. Stability drops, enemies start spawning in small-ish numbers. Keep stability during the storm above that threshold, and the storm ends quicker. The more instable you are, the more and harder enemies show up. At a certain point of low instability, make it so the storm will rage during its' entire duration and no way to shorten it. Beyond that - increase the loot a smidge and perhaps some sort of lingering after effect post storm. As is, the storms give no reason to actually engage with the enemies. People see the pitiful loot and think "damn that's it" and then ignore the storms going forward by skipping them entirely. Which, as has been thoroughly discussed in this thread and others, renders the entire mechanic moot. Turning VS into 7dtd would be the worst decision the devs could make. I'm not opposed to enemies being able to open/knock down doors or gates, but absolutely devastating peoples builds - people would stop building because what would be the point. Which is anathema to the point of this game entirely. As mentioned elsewhere as well - the Bloodmoon mechanic in 7dtd has NO cap. It will progressively become more intense and difficult the longer you play, eventually leading to the point that the Bloodmoons become impossible to survive, and everything you've built to withstand them will be detroyed beyond the point of being fun to repair. The Temporal Storms are NOT that. They have an intensity cap. We should be (and I'm sure we are, without spoiling) incentivised to find a way of stopping the storms/rust corruption. This. It would be far too much of a punishment,

I see we both have the same RNG skill, for better or worse lol.

Agreed 100% - which is why I used to play with the Plains and Valleys mod (sadly not compatible with Terra Pretty which I'm giving a tryout atm). Larger relatively flat sections between upheavals would be really lovely and tuck in very nicely with rivers when they get that sorted - I really hope they reach out to the creator of the mod watersheds, which in my opinion, is the best damn rivers type mod that I've seen - I do wish they were longer for river traversal but even with the shortened versions it REALLY makes the environment much more visually appealing. Plains are a must. Clover would be wonderful too. Great suggestion.

I haven't yet loaded or played the latest update yet - I always wait for the first stable build (and for my fav must have mods to update) before I truly give it a test run, but I definitely was a biiiit concerned with some of the things. Mostly, I like the looks of the update and understand that there's going to be balancing to come. So, definitely eyeballing people's feedback here. On one hand, I like the look of adjusting berry production. As it presently stands, they're the cheesiest early game mechanic, just slap the bush with your hands/knife/axe and uproot the entire thing and bring it back home. That's a liiiiiittle too simple in a game that has very in depth mechanics elsewhere. I am a bit concerend about the fiddly looking mechanics for propagation and fertilizer requirement however - I think it would be better served to simply be able to harvest seeds from berries that you can replant, give them a similar type of mechanic as the fruit trees - wherein some of the planted seeds have a chance of not surviving - and tie their berry growth to seasons as mentioned above. With option to fertilize to increase bounty on harvest. While I love the majority of the in depth crafting, harvesting, cooking mechanics etc - there's also the possibility of going TOO far with that, and making the game so cumbersome that it will feel too burdensome, especially to solo players. On a server with a group of people I'm sure it's not that bad as the work gets spread around. So then it becomes a balancing act between ensuring enough content for the multiplayer servers, and not being too burdensome on the solo or 2-3 co-op players.

*raises hand* I was one of them. Bingo. As it stands currently the Temporal Storms don't directly tie-in, in a meaningful way I would have anticipated or expected, with other game mechanics. Which results in the Storms feeling separate and apart and ergo feeling a bit raid mechanic-y, and if that's what they are, it's a very unsatisfying experience interacting with them with little reasonable payoff for what you have to go through. If the Storms are just a raid mechanic, well there's ample games out there that have done it better and devs can learn from those rather than leave a half assed attempt. If that's not what they are, then they're missing the mark on what they're supposed to be and not blending well with other mechanics to make them feel like a comprehensive part of the experience other than 'ignore this annoying thing either by hiding or turning them off, or get ganked by T3-T4 mobs that you're woefully unprepared for, oh and they can spawn inside you base LOL GET GUD'. As one of those people with horrid RNG, my first experience of this game was a never ending death spiral, rage quit, restart cycle on the normal settings because I like to experience the vanilla intentional version of a game. By pure tenacity is the reason I've stuck around and this game has become one of my favourites that I enjoy seeing updates for. Ten other friends, went through a similar experience and absolutely refuse to touch this game again. Hence the need for a proper on-ramp/tutorial of some sort for this game. Beyond that, the mechanic needs something to make it worthwhile engaging with.

Because walls infer protection in some degree, otherwise why give us a sandbox where we can build to our hearts content? If the only option to not being attacked without warning inside your base is to either bury yourself in a hole, or turn the mechanic off and not miss out on the rest of the Lore or the rest of the game, then the mechanic doesn't matter. Deliberately overlooking the multitude of suggestions that have been mentioned within this thread alone merely because you don't like them, doesn't mean that no one has offered any other ideas on how to implement Temporal Storms. The main point of contention seems to be: people want to engage with the storms but are annoyed by the lack of reason for doing so, lacklustre rewards in the absence of any other reason to experience this mechanic, and want preferably a heads up or functional way of mitigating spawns of rust baddies, and high tier enemies spawning during storms which is entirely unfair for a player new to the world lacking proper equipment to take them on - thus having to hide and ride it out. As mentioned before, I have bad RNG and the amount of times I've had a rust baddie spawn directly behind me inside my base during a storm, with no indication its' there until it's up my... tail pipe, is ridiculous. Maybe this doesn't happen to everyone, fine. But it has happened enough to me that I turned the storms off due to a lack of being able to mitigate this happening in game - hence suggestions of giving us a craftable pre-Jonas tech that will give the player a safety bubble where enemies won't spawn in, so one can better prepare. Or tie Rift spawn to the storms, have enemies spawn from Storm Rifts with a touch of a delay and allow Rifts to spawn wherever, including inside your base, but the appearance of the Rift and a bit of a delay gives you time to react - whether that's going and hiding or choosing to fight - we should get that choice. Other suggestions such as increased visual distortions to varying degrees depending on storm severity I like the thought of too and additional features to stability. It's a bit of an underbaked mechanic atm which is why it leads to such divisive discussions about it. The game is functionally a sandbox crafting, building and exploration game with an actual functional back story that the player discovers at their own pace. To disallow the player the creative discernment as to whether or not they want to engage with the storms and the enemies from them, by forcing them to have to deal with enemies that can spawn anywhere including within their own base, functionally contradicts the underlying creative sandbox theme. Sometimes, we just don't WANT to fight enemies in that moment, forcing us to fight because devs and lore say so, is a piss poor way of doing game dev - which is why I brought up 7dtd in the first place.

No, and I'm not interested in engaging in video game whataboutisms either. COD is hardly a reasonable comparison to VS. What difference does it make with how the TS's work presently, when enemies can spawn inside your base, behind you, disobeying the fact that your walls exist already? Frankly, I plan on turning that part of the mod off - but the other parts of it, Rifts spawning as part of the storm and the rust devastation etc, I'm interested in checking out.

Yes, I linked to it earlier. I want to give it a try and see if it resolves the issues I've personally been having with the TS's.

The reward for spending hours making your house pretty is your enjoyment of it - that -is- the game reward. There is -no- game relevant reward to the Temporal Storms presently aside from some components that may or may not be useful to the player depending on where they are timeline wise in their playthrough, hence the arguments against being able to turn them off and just never engage with them. It doesn't have to be a specifically lootable reward. The reward can and should be with the experience of the mechanic itself - whether that be choosing to engage in with the baddies and get some pieces of loot that are potentially useful, or the process of the mechanic be fun to actually interact with. At the present, the TS's don't provide -enough- of that feedback to a chunk of players, to the point that the mechanic can be bypassed entirely without having a direct impact on the rest of the game itself. Suggestions have varied from making loot a bit more useful, suggestions for making the actual event itself more fun or even more challenging, to having some aftereffect to them as a lingering reminder of wtf is going on in the gameworld. At present, rust baddies can simply spawn quietly behind you within the confines of your base, with no warning to properly prep - unless they spawn in another room/other level and you can at least hear them wandering about. If they spawn right behind you you're likely to be near one-tapped without notice.

THIS The mere fact that the player -can- turn the TS's off and NOT LOSE ANYTHING in terms of the main function of the game and the Lore - renders them a moot mechanic. Given that the Temporal Storms are lauded as a critical Lore important -thing- then the aforementioned is egregious. We're not talking about loot cannoning goodies to the player. We're discussing functionality of gameplay of the mechanic itself. When I first heard of the Temporal Storms, I thought that would mean that it would spawn Rifts, and from those Rifts would spawn the enemies. Instead, we get visual wibbly wobbly that makes it difficult to -do- anything (yes, you can turn these effects down - aka *season* their effects for preferred gameplay) and enemies that spawn anywhere, with no bounds, no rules, and the player has to deal with them after being surprised. And then there's no post effect TO the storms, they just up and end and bleh. Dave is a fantastic piece in the background that leans into the existential horror of the storms, but after a handful of storms, you stop paying attention. The Storms spawning Rifts would make more sense to the monsters spawning inside our bases, give a bit of a cooldown after spawn so that the player has a moment to go "oh f-ck!" and get a weapon/prep, and deal with whatever comes out of the Rift. When the storm ends, the baddies from the Rift weaken and have some way of removing the Rift or have it despawn in a certain period of time. Just a spitballed idea off the top of my head, but this makes the event more engaging, gives the player a chance to prepare if they were initially just hiding inside, gives the player the choice to decide on how to respond - as opposed to storm happens, enemy spawns quietly behind you with no preparation possible, one taps you from behind scaring the bejesus out of you, and then death spiral initiates.

I said nothing of high action in any of my comments - consistently my statements have been about making the Temporal Storms more compelling to actually engage with, rather then sleep through them, shut them off, or bury yourself in a block hole and walk away during the duration of the storm. My only comparison to 7dtd is the -relative- similarity of the events and highlight what bad game development does to a game mechanic, when the devs become hyper focused in forcing the playerbase to play a certain specific way, in a game that is predominantly a sandbox survival. I made mention of one area where they actually did something good with their development, by accomodating for it elsewhere, and the player base settled down after initial grumblings because it ended up working. TS's already present a relative tower defense style, which is why I mentioned that. Regardless, they're an interruption that the player has to deal with, which that's fine. It's just we don't want enemies able to consistently spawn INSIDE our bases - we want some form of safety -at some point- with time investment. Especially considering the gameplay once you spawn into the world is focused on the player homesteading and prepping to cave spelunk and engage with the actual storyline. That begs that there should be SOME way of mitigating the storms, including in the earlier stages, besides walling ourselves in and walking away from the game, which is purely a bad game design choice. If you're designing your game for players to disengage and walk away from it, then you've not succeeded in creating a compelling mechanic that the players actually want to interact with, or a portion of them anyways. All people want is more reason to engage with the storms - loot that is slightly more useful than a few pieces of flax fibers, and the occasional gear or Jonas part, which is useless in the early game anyways. This is an entirely different mentality than what has formed in the community of 7dtd, where the devs have focused on funneling their development into trying to force players to engage with a mechanic that, by design, will eventually render a gameworld impossible to play in - there is no cap on Bloodmoon intensity. Eventually, your gameworld will be so strong/levelled up, that surviving a Bloodmoon will become impossible - yes this can be very drawn out by adjusting when Bloodmoons happen and spawns etc, but it will eventually reach the point where your Horde base will suffer so much damage that the 'fun' of repairing it will be gone. Uncompromising doesn't have to mean no fun. Inducing ragequitting seems like a very poor motivation for creating game mechanics.

This is exactly why I brought up 7dtd in my earlier posts. Every discussion about Temporal Storms - specifically about how they're currently implemented, all the players commenting want to see the mechanic improved to encourage us to engage with it, rather than simply turn it off. It's a different kind of divisiveness compared to the 7dtd community, but it's here. I definitely don't want to see the TS mechanic become something that VS devs start trying to force the player base to engage with it in the way they feel we should be engaging with it - as I mentioned in previous comments. VS is largely a sandbox game with deep Lore that the player uncovers, unlike that other block game. But when creating specific mechanics in a sandbox game, some devs - looking at The Fun Pimps here - decide that there's only one way to engage with a mechanic and hyper focus all their development into trying to funnel/push the players down a specific pipeline, which led to them almost entirely ignoring the progress on the rest of the game. Ten years+ later, TFP have finally learned their lesson. We don't want to see that with VS but unanimously most people agree that the TS's need some tweaking - it's not a horrible mechanic in an of itself, it can create longevity of play which ultimately, is what game devs focus on. We want to see the mechanic improved to the point that players are more willing to engage with it regularly, yes if that includes options on how to 'season' it as LadyWHT so eloquently described it, that's a good possibility. As the TS's currently stand however, look no further than peoples comments, a good chunk of people avoid the storms - either by burying themselves in a small hole and walk away from the game, sleep through them with that option on, or simply turn them off. It just begs that the mechanic should be looked at again by the devs - not to punish people for disengaging or trying to force players to engage in a specific manner, but to make the mechanic more compelling to engage with.