Skills system?

[manollette]

I thought this would be a frequent-flier suggestion, but I'm not seeing it, and it's not in the roadmap. VS is a game where any activity you choose to do takes time - it's incredibly involved, and on that basis, it encourages multiplayer groups to take on roles. Would a skills system to further expand on this be feasible? Basic concept overall:

Taking part in an activity - smithing, mining, combat, etc - improves your skill in that area, tracked by a player variable. As the player's skill increases, their effectiveness in that area increases as well. Smithed tools last longer/weapons are stronger, you can make more pottery for less clay, prospecting is more accurate/useful - things like that. 

 

[xXx_Ape_xXx]

There's a mod doing exactly what you're suggesting, called XSkills

 

[manollette]

Still standing by it as a suggestion. That said, never really been into mods, but this might convince me to give it a go. Thanks!

[Broccoli Clock]

8 hours ago, manollette said:

Still standing by it as a suggestion. That said, never really been into mods, but this might convince me to give it a go. Thanks!

There is a thread on here covering the mod... 

Personally I like the idea of character progression, but I would much prefer it was within vanilla, as I don't think they would be so OP (imo). I'm sure it can be tweaked, but the buffs such as the ability to do extra high jumps or have constant light underground just doesn't seem right.

[Crysta]

I want to add my support for this being vanilla, the mod is so nice from what I have learned from my friends and seen ingame(haven't progressed through much yet myself though), and it appears to solve several gripes I have had, like with bloomeries and bee hives deleting resources into the void when destroyed. It doesn't simply remove that mechanic but gives you something to work towards to solve that which is nice in games to be able to work to solve a problem and feel proud when you do. It also is just satisfying when you level up. So I really think this should be vanilla, it improves the game in lots of ways. Probably with some tweaks as needed like others mentioned.

[Tabbot95]

skills would allow for some things; mostly "class exclusive crafting recipes" to be a little less "class specific"; as that seems to disproportionately favor the tailor over all others

[CastIronFabric]

On 6/9/2025 at 11:47 AM, manollette said:

I thought this would be a frequent-flier suggestion, but I'm not seeing it, and it's not in the roadmap. VS is a game where any activity you choose to do takes time - it's incredibly involved, and on that basis, it encourages multiplayer groups to take on roles. Would a skills system to further expand on this be feasible? Basic concept overall:

Taking part in an activity - smithing, mining, combat, etc - improves your skill in that area, tracked by a player variable. As the player's skill increases, their effectiveness in that area increases as well. Smithed tools last longer/weapons are stronger, you can make more pottery for less clay, prospecting is more accurate/useful - things like that. 

 

I personally love the approach they are taking to progression.

I am not against skill systems in fact Wurm Unlimited, a game I played for a long time, has 'over 130 skills', however, I like the idea of having the same feeling of progress but having it rooted more in reality (aka, stone age, copper, bronze then steel). That said what I really do NOT like is effectively 'Perk Systems' like Xskills, not a fan. I like the way Wurm does it which is the vast majority of the skills you just get better at the more you do it or automatically unlocks something that you do not go in an 'choose'. I understand the argument for Perk Systems and its a good argument am just not a fan.

As a side note to Wurm Unlimited specifically, what makes the skill system palatable is being able to change the skill progression speed so one does not end up grinding just for skill. That balance is usually making it maxed out speed becasue Wurm default skill progression is extreeeeeeeeeemly slow.

[LadyWYT]

57 minutes ago, CastIronFabric said:

As a side note to Wurm Unlimited specifically, what makes the skill system palatable is being able to change the skill progression speed so one does not end up grinding just for skill.

I've never played Wurm, but the time sink required for skill progression in general is why I'm against such systems for Vintage Story. Most of VS's progression is tied directly to what the player does in the game; there's a few things the player needs to wait on(like steel refining, leatherworking process, etc) but for the most part the player can progress as fast as they want, if they have the knowledge and skill to do so. Additionally, the current vanilla system makes it much easier to jump right into multiplayer and start having fun, without the player feeling like they're perpetually behind the power curve.

I've played with XSkills before, which does add a skill progression system as suggested in this thread. However, it's quite the time sink, and the player's skill and knowledge ends up being far less valuable given how effective most of the skills are and the fact that the only way to level up the skills is to sink time into those particular tasks(or eating skill books that were bought/found). In some cases, the skills end up very underwhelming, since by the time the player unlocks them the skills are no longer very useful. Another drawback is that while the player is limited to two skill tree specializations(which is required for picking certain special skills), there's no limit otherwise to how many skills the player can acquire, so a player could pretty much unlock most bonuses should they play long enough.

I would say it's a stronger system in multiplayer since it can allow players to specialize a lot more, however, the problem is that unless everyone is playing for equal amounts of time there is absolutely going to be a massive disparity in character strength. Players who play more often will be much stronger than players who can't play as much, and there's really no way to catch up(outside of admin intervention) once a player falls behind, unless they somehow manage to play more than everyone else for an extended time.

For those reasons, I vote no on a skill system. I prefer the status effect system ideas that have been floated instead. Basically, that kind of system could allow the player to experience some consequences for various actions taken in the game. Some of those actions could result in new, permanent character traits(either good or bad) in addition to the class traits that the player starts with, or they could just be temporary and wear off after a while. In the case of permanent traits, the player could perhaps pay an NPC for specific combat training and get a bonus to melee or ranged damage, or if the player makes a habit of harming NPCs they could get a bad reputation and get worse prices when it comes to trade. Temporary traits could be things like benefits from drinking certain concoctions(requires an herbalism system), suffering a broken bone in combat and having a movement speed penalty while the injury heals, or needing to practice archery regularly to maintain a bonus to ranged damage and accuracy.

[CastIronFabric]

13 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

I've never played Wurm, but the time sink required for skill progression in general is why I'm against such systems for Vintage Story. Most of VS's progression is tied directly to what the player does in the game; there's a few things the player needs to wait on(like steel refining, leatherworking process, etc) but for the most part the player can progress as fast as they want, if they have the knowledge and skill to do so. Additionally, the current vanilla system makes it much easier to jump right into multiplayer and start having fun, without the player feeling like they're perpetually behind the power curve.

I've played with XSkills before, which does add a skill progression system as suggested in this thread. However, it's quite the time sink, and the player's skill and knowledge ends up being far less valuable given how effective most of the skills are and the fact that the only way to level up the skills is to sink time into those particular tasks(or eating skill books that were bought/found). In some cases, the skills end up very underwhelming, since by the time the player unlocks them the skills are no longer very useful. Another drawback is that while the player is limited to two skill tree specializations(which is required for picking certain special skills), there's no limit otherwise to how many skills the player can acquire, so a player could pretty much unlock most bonuses should they play long enough.

I would say it's a stronger system in multiplayer since it can allow players to specialize a lot more, however, the problem is that unless everyone is playing for equal amounts of time there is absolutely going to be a massive disparity in character strength. Players who play more often will be much stronger than players who can't play as much, and there's really no way to catch up(outside of admin intervention) once a player falls behind, unless they somehow manage to play more than everyone else for an extended time.

For those reasons, I vote no on a skill system. I prefer the status effect system ideas that have been floated instead. Basically, that kind of system could allow the player to experience some consequences for various actions taken in the game. Some of those actions could result in new, permanent character traits(either good or bad) in addition to the class traits that the player starts with, or they could just be temporary and wear off after a while. In the case of permanent traits, the player could perhaps pay an NPC for specific combat training and get a bonus to melee or ranged damage, or if the player makes a habit of harming NPCs they could get a bad reputation and get worse prices when it comes to trade. Temporary traits could be things like benefits from drinking certain concoctions(requires an herbalism system), suffering a broken bone in combat and having a movement speed penalty while the injury heals, or needing to practice archery regularly to maintain a bonus to ranged damage and accuracy.

I think you misunderstand.

in Wurm if you have the skill gain set to max. by the time you get done what you need to get done you have already gained the skill points you need for the next thing. Like Xskills you NEVER have to grind on something that you would not have to grind anyway the exact same number of clicks.

For example, like in Xskills, by the time you find where you want to live and find the copper you need you already have enough survial skill points to get a perk. Wurm with skills set to max progression is the same thing. In XSkills by the time you get to iron you are already making high quality items without making anything you do not need anyway. So for example, it would take you longer to create a farm than the farm point you need in order to move forward, so you would not be making farms that you do not need just to increase the skill. With that said I am not voting for skill system either I am just trying to explain where you misunderstand

 

makes sense?

Edited December 25, 2025 by CastIronFabric

[LadyWYT]

1 hour ago, CastIronFabric said:

I think you misunderstand.

in Wurm if you have the skill gain set to max. by the time you get done what you need to get done you have already gained the skill points you need for the next thing. Like Xskills you NEVER have to grind on something that you would not have to grind anyway the exact same number of clicks.

For example, like in Xskills, by the time you find where you want to live and find the copper you need you already have enough survial skill points to get a perk. Wurm with skills set to max progression is the same thing. In XSkills by the time you get to iron you are already making high quality items without making anything you do not need anyway. So for example, it would take you longer to create a farm than the farm point you need in order to move forward, so you would not be making farms that you do not need just to increase the skill. With that said I am not voting for skill system either I am just trying to explain where you misunderstand

 

makes sense?

Kind of? But my point about XSkills remains the same. It's very easy to fall behind the power curve in multiplayer if you're not playing as much as everyone else. In singleplayer it was okay, but I found that by the time I was actually unlocking many skills, they weren't really that useful anymore since I was already a year or two into the game.

[CastIronFabric]

9 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

Kind of? But my point about XSkills remains the same. It's very easy to fall behind the power curve in multiplayer if you're not playing as much as everyone else. In singleplayer it was okay, but I found that by the time I was actually unlocking many skills, they weren't really that useful anymore since I was already a year or two into the game.

that is not true, I am not even taking a position of that being my opinion. I have played Xskills plenty of time and in all cases I get the skill before I get the stuff I want to get done done. I never changed by play at all and yes BOTH multiplayer and single player.

Now MAYBE if a person just wants to max out XSkills themselves, perhaps but why?

regardless, no grinding required in XSkills

Edited December 25, 2025 by CastIronFabric

[remilishus]

I 100% agree I feel like this would allow for newer players to have something to work toward because when i first started I was so lost lmao.