ifoz

It's strange to me that roof beams cannot be obtained in survival mode - they allow you to circumvent some of the current roof system's shortcomings, and are used extensively in one of the story locations and on some of the trader dwellings. If they just made roof beams obtainable (and somewhat inexpensive) in survival mode, it would give a lot of freedom to builders while a proper roof system could be worked on in the background. They just need a handful of crafting recipes for the roof beams.

VS Roofing is definitely one of those few mods that I hope are just integrated into vanilla, at least in a simplified form. The vanilla roofing blocks are one of the most restrictive parts of building, to the point the new trader structures don't even bother with them and just use creative mode colliders and beams to make nice roofing. If the devs themselves would rather not use the regular roofing blocks, what does that say about them as a feature (I'm mostly being silly, but I do think it's kind of funny how even the devs try to avoid using them in favour of beam roofing).

This honestly has to be my favourite logo redraw so far, I really feel like it really manages to hit all the key elements. The tree, the gears being hidden underneath, the general colour palette, and importantly the 'clock' face still being the dials of a certain important set piece, rather than just a regular clock. I also think the hand-drawn/painted look is a much better fit for VS than bold lines and harsh divides between shades.

I also think glue won't be fully complete until you can properly repair certain clutter items, rather than just be able to pick up their rubble. Ruined chests are one of the main ones to me, since they make no real sense. You cannot use/repair them when they have items inside, and when emptied out they break into 'chest rubble', which can be repaired. Using glue on the rubble of a chest you just shattered a moment ago just gives you the pile of rubble. I don't think it would be particularly game-breaking either, as ruined chests only have the capacity of a reed chest. Being able to glue and use them would be a really nice decorative option.

I usually don't play with glue enabled (instead just being able to pick up clutter without it), but I've been messing around with it recently and the resin-clutter ratio is a bit insane to me. 6 resin gets you enough glue to fully repair one clutter item. This means that if you wanted to collect an aged red banner from a dungeon (comes in three segments, since the top and bottom runners are separate items) you would need 18 resin. For what is essentially one decorative item. It seems a little crazy to me that this is the glue-resin ratio! I think a much better option would be if 6 resin allowed you to fully repair two or three clutter items, but then have the semi-repaired (33%, 66%) states as portions of litres. That way you could still have that risk/reward player choice, while still making glue overall cheaper. Anyway, let me know what you think about glue balance! That's a bit of a strange sentence.

They weren't really knocked back a version, just that expansions to the system were. This ruin is currently the only type of dynamic dungeon in the game, made as both something of a proof of concept, though also something intended to be in the game at this point. We know there are larger expansions planned for them though, in the 1.22._ patch with other shelved 1.22 content as well as in future updates.

While dry grass is the easiest ingredient to acquire for dyes, green cloth still needs to be mordanted first before it can be dyed. Making mordant requires a pulveriser setup, as well as alum, tin or chromite. Blue and brown on the other hand are the only two colours that don't require mordant at all, so can be dyed prior to having mechanical power.

Your best bet would be going into creative mode (/gm c), breaking the gravel, and then switching back to survival mode (/gm s). It's not supposed to be there, just a quirk of unlucky world generation.

The only real ones I can think of that would become imbalanced would potentially be the arctic hunter set - since it's intended as a lategame fur set upgrade that is on par with Tailor's warm sets. Reindeer herder would also become cheaper, but since Tailor now has other sets that use cheaper cloths (brown, blue, white) and are just as warm, that's less of a concern. Still, since mechanical power is needed to make mordant in the first place, I think even if the arctic hunter set was put more firmly into the midgame through being more accessible due to madder, it'd still be gated well enough to keep fur relevant through the earlier parts of the game. Tailor got a bit of a buff in 1.22 with their new winter sets, since stuff like embroidered fur and arctic fisher are just as warm as reindeer herder/arctic hunter, but only require brown and blue cloth. The shirts are the exception, with the embroidered fur shirt needing white (borax-dyed) cloth, and the arctic fisher shirt needing red cloth. Still, a tailor with only linen, pelts, woad and tannin can still get a set comparable to reindeer herder/arctic hunter.

Relating to my previous suggestion about how I thought clothing traders should also purchase dyed cloth, I think madder root would make a lot of sense as an addition to the game. Madder root was used in the real life middle ages as a red dye. Currently, the only way we can get red dye in the game is through finding cinnabar, which is both rare and toxic. Red should probably be a much more common colour of dye than it is currently ingame, with purple cloth becoming the rare/luxury colour in its stead. Irl, madder root can ground up and then dissolved in sulphuric acid (both things we could do ingame, with the quern and sulphuric acid), which leaves behind the red dye that can then be used to colour cloth. This still does need a mordant, so it would be more of a midgame dye, but would be more reliable than finding cinnabar.

I just realised it was a little strange that clothing traders both sold and bought items of clothing. Buying a few items of clothing makes sense, but not buying any sewing supplies at all seems a bit strange to me given they have things like dyed fabric placed around their huts. I think it could be a nice change if clothing traders would buy clothing, as well as sewing supplies. This would give non-tailor players a bit more of an incentive to make some colours of dyed cloth as well, since they could be sold to clothing traders. Blue and brown dyed cloth would sell for the least due to being easiest to acquire and not needing mordant, while red cloth would sell for the most since it's the rarest to acquire and needs mordant. (This also doesn't really make sense - red should probably be easy enough to obtain from something like madder root, while purple cloth should be the rare one, but that's not really the point of this suggestion).

This is a short one, yet remains a tale of doom, despair, and why too much of a good thing can sometimes end up being bad. In the multiple years I have been playing VS for at this point, I have never seen this happen... Until today. "I heard you liked ruins, and I heard you liked translocators, so I put your translocator right in the path of a ruin entrance, and it got deleted".

It could also be interesting if stock lists and prices varied based on how far from general civilisation a trader was. If a treasure hunter is very far out, they'd have a few extra items of stock, and maybe some special offers. On the other hand if they were closer, they'd have less stock and higher prices due to the lack of ruins nearby. Same for something like a building materials trader - out in the wilderness they'd primarily sell planks, raw daub, clay, mudbrick and logs. Closer to civilisation is when they'd start stocking wallpaper, polished stone and coloured ceramic bricks. Clothing traders in the wilds could sell more practical pieces (fur/warm clothes, and some pre-owned ragged pieces on the cheap), while closer to civilisation they'd start selling fancier and embroidered things. The same goes for what they'd buy - traders in the wilderness wouldn't be very picky at all, but a trader closer to a general area of civilisation might request specific types of food, tools or clothing. ------------ Unrelated to the above, but I just have to say this thread has brought up some awesome ideas. I've always been interested with the traders and potential interactions they could theoretically have, and that's only been expedited with their 1.22 makeover!

That does make sense, yeah. I just mentioned ragged clothing because there are a few ragged/tattered trader clothes, but not many made of pelts. There is the leather/bone jacket and the trader fur wrap, but other than that there isn't much pelt/hide clothing for the traders right now. It'd make sense if there was though, especially for survival traders. That and more fur clothes for the cold climate traders. Cold traders can't wear sandals or any footwear with exposed skin, which makes sense, but they can still wear things like short sleeve shirts. There are some trader fur clothes (two types of fur boots, the fur wrap, the fur shirt, the warm vest and the fur vest) but I think that if cold traders were more likely to wear these types of warm clothing, there would probably need to be more so that they could have about equal variation as the other traders.

They probably need to do a quick 1.22 parity pass through the story locations, I've noticed. There's a few features that were changed/updated, but that haven't changed in the story locations. Berry bushes still being the legacy bush type, the forges facing the wrong way, the aged roofing no longer matching with the aged planks beneath, the ladders all being oak, bellows missing from the forge area, armour stands used instead of mannequins in one area.

I think I've said it before in a different post, but it'd be awesome to see the luxuries trader system work for other trader types. Luxuries currently can't wear anything to do with bones or any footwraps - expanding this to other traders could be really interesting. Treasure hunters being more likely to wear scrap armour and things like the mining helmet, climbing belt and filament lamp. Clothing traders not being able to wear anything too raggedy or tattered, survival goods traders being more likely to wear something raggedy or tattered.

This would be fun for the ruined door variants (make ruins a little more atmospheric), though sadly 1.22 made it so they disintegrate when broken and so can't be used in player builds anymore. They do actually open slower already though - the regular ruined door with both hinges opens at a normal speed, but the ones with the missing hinge open at a slower speed. I don't know about having it like this for the player-crafted aged/very aged doors though, since the hinges on those are new iron. They look like the player has taken the wooden boards, and then installed new hinges onto them.

Unrelated, but thought you might be interested to know that some of the trader sets' internal names give us some clues of what else these people get up to other than sitting at home and trading. There's sets (I say sets, but usually it's one or two pieces with a special name per) with the names; 'sailor', 'trapper', 'forester', 'spelunker', 'scholar' and the 'shady' one I mentioned earlier. Some also have other unnamed pieces that look like they could be part of that set - the forester jacket for example is the exact same shade of green as the rag handwraps, so I imagine they were designed together. The 'shady' coat matches with the 'Nadiyan eye' hood, as well as the copper-reinforced gloves and boots. The sailor hose have the same stitching style (brown seam with red cross stitching) as one of the short sleeve shirts. Sailor set consists of a vest and hose, though also that shirt if you count it. Scholar is a vest and hose, trapper is a hat and hose. Forester is just a jacket, but does have the matching handwraps. Shady is just a coat, but has the matching hood, gloves and boots. Spelunker is just a shirt, but does match with the mining helmet due to being mining-related. Sidenote but a bit of a fun fact, luxuries traders are actually prevented from wearing certain poorer/more primitive items. Anything to do with bone (wolf skull mask, bone bracers, bone jacket, etc) as well as any footwraps are taken out of their wearable pool. Just some cool details about the traders and what they get up to! The different sets I mentioned, though I combined forester and trapper onto one mannequin. You can't normally get these in survival yet, I'm showing them like this through editing the game's files and replacing normal player clothing with them.

Something with the new traders, I really hope they get more varied dialogue. All of them have identical dialogue, including the reason they're out there in the first place (wealth). Giving different traders different dialogue would be really fun, even if there were only 5-10 different dialogue styles a trader would randomly spawn with. Maybe even relate it to their 'personality'. Currently, traders have a kind of 'personality' (I don't know what it's actually called) that determines how they greet you, and their posture. It's why some traders hold their hands behind their back when idle and gesture with one hand when approached, why some stand up straight and extend both arms in greeting, why some are hunched over and wave when greeting you. I don't think posture is linked to greeting gesture, but they are set for each trader when they generate. That kind of thing could be expanded into a few different variants of the standard dialogue, with different tones and reasons for being out in the wilds. One of them could be the standard 'wealth' reasoning, one could be the lone survivor of an overrun settlement, one could have grown up out there and had traders for parents, one could have been taken in by traders when visiting a settlement, one could have grown up in a larger settlement but always dreamed of living off the land ever since they were young, one might just dislike company and would rather live in the wilds than around people, one might find it useful to live in the wilds for the untouched loot in ruins, one might have been thrown out of their settlement for some disagreement or crime, etc. That and more voice instrument variation for traders would go a long way to giving them more personality (though the new models definitely helped a lot!)

Only if they do it so that if you buy into every scam offer, on something like the fifth time, whatever item he offers is in fact legitimate or useful and he doesn't know. Do you know which interview this was? I've seen a few of the various dev interviews, but probably not all of them, or missed this part. I'm hoping if they do add bandits, they don't just have them as enemies. I don't think they would though, given they probably understand that'd go against the game's general themes to have human foes who just kill on sight. Way less interesting than offering interactions with them too, especially if certain interactions were class-specific. I mean, we can even play as a bandit/thief (Malefactor). To let us do that and then just have bandits/thieves as enemies with no further depth would be a bit strange. In the worst case scenario where they decide to have bandits and then for whatever reason just make them hostile on sight, I'd be pretty unhappy with their inclusion. Having more humanoid enemies that aren't Rust creatures doesn't bring much to the table if they attack you all the same, and it'd take away from player/class roleplay. Half the classes probably have killing someone as the last thing they want to do, and bandit enemies would have this happen multiple times over. (Clockmaker and Tailor are averse to violence, and Malefactor's weakness in combat is established to be from a guilty conscience / not wanting to hurt anyone). In such a world I'd probably get a mod to make them neutral, just to have that element of choice. I know I said it earlier, but I think a far better implementation would be having them surrender or run off after fighting, with the player able to demand gears for their release. That way you'd get a reward for dealing with them and getting them out of the area, without excessive violence and/or death. That or not even having them as true enemies, and instead a neutral faction with unique interactions. (It'd be pretty fun if you could gamble with them over a game of omok, just sayin'!)

I'm kind of leaning the same way right now - bandits could definitely exist and/or be implied, but I think if any kind of shifty or shady NPCs were to be added that they shouldn't be particularly hostile. You could still have thief/scavenger type traders who just have different dialogue and trade in different goods, without including things like an actual theft system or way to aggro them. I think that could be a nice way to include some more trader variation and flavour, without making it so you actually have to fight them. Maybe give their dialogue a gruff/less friendly tone as well, just to set them apart. Honestly if the Malefactor mask gives +1 skullduggery, some of the trader masks would give +10 It's kind of funny that the Seraphs aren't really dressed all that strangely compared to the traders, who will wear things like wolf skulls strapped to their faces, the bones of a rabbit hung around their necks, old welding masks, primitive gas masks. The devs have said before they plan to make trader clothing wearable by the player (my best guess is in the upcoming 1.22._ update with other shelved 1.22 content), it'll be interesting to see what kind of outfits players make with this stuff. A little while back I messed around with the files to insert trader clothing onto the player (internally it's all Seraph-sized, but the game trims it down to fit the traders). This is one of the outfits I came up with, a mix of the 'shady' set and the 'sailor' hose, the 'dark' shirt and the mining helmet for good measure. (The pendant and belt are already Seraph clothing though, I just thought they looked nice with this outfit).

Just adding this on here because I forgot to add it to my above post, but I don't think most nomads would be in the stone age. This makes me think that the "nomads" he mentions are a primarily scavenging group, who would use metal scrap for tools and armour. That could also give them more of a Vintage Story-esq vibe to their attire and encampments, being made of bits and pieces from old ruins.

I honestly don't know about including a system where bandits could rob you for items unless there was also some chance to get them back. Currently, when you trade with a trader, the item you traded disappears from the world forever in exchange for gears. Unless there was a way you could steal your stuff back from the bandits, I don't think it'd be that great to have them rob you and then your stuff is gone for good. I also do still think bandits would be very intimidated by the Seraph - not only for the reasons I mentioned before, but the Seraph folktales/rumours Tobias talks about. It's clear the new worlders are a very superstitious lot of people, and for all the bandits know, provoking a Seraph might have them smote down with lightning or crushed under the fist of a fire-maned giant. I imagine a group of bandits who robs the traders would be very cautious of a Seraph, preferring to either stay away, or only do trade if the Seraph proves to be non-aggressive. -------------- I think it would be interesting if there were two main types of bandits - actual bandits, and regular people reduced to thievery due to circumstance. Regular bandits would be a bit more well-off than the latter, and probably not try and pick a fight with the player unless they were loaded with riches and seemed defenceless. They might trade in curiosities and other scavenged goods, but be generally shadier and kind of untrustworthy. Their prices might also not be the fairest. The poorer type would be a desperate trader or villager, who would probably be more outright aggressive just because they need food/gears to survive another day. This kind would also probably surrender or run away if their health got too low, rather than fight to the death. If they surrendered and then the player offered them a few gears or a meal, they might thank the player by telling nearby traders of their kindness, giving a small reputation increase among the nearest traders. -------------- Now that I'm thinking about the concept of trader reputation, I think being able to intimidate/threaten traders could be an interesting mechanic. Successfully threatening a trader would depend on your equipped items and your class (Malefactor and Blackguard would have higher chances, and wearing higher tier armour and anything to do with bones or teeth would also increase the chances. Malefactor's higher chance would be due to their past experience with thievery providing them the right kind of threats that would get a trader to cough up some goods, and Blackguard purely because of their strong build and intimidation factor). When successfully threatened, a trader would give the player 2-3 random items from their stocklist, and then refuse to trade again and have the player suffer a large reputation penalty. If the threat is unsuccessful, there would be two outcomes. The first, if the player is woefully underequipped, would be the trader just laughing them off with a minor reputation penalty. The second would be that the trader would get angry and try to chase the player out, with the player suffering a moderate reputation loss. -------------- I also think that outright killing bandits for trying to rob you might go a little against the game's themes of humanity banding together. It could be fun if when their health got very low, bandits would either just run away or surrender. If they surrendered, the player could either let them go for free, or demand whatever gears they have on them. That way there's still a reward for the effort of dealing with them, but you don't actually have to kill them.

I like the idea of the player being able to get on friendly terms with bandits, it'd add more dynamic to the world. I imagine it'd be something like the travelling grave robbers you can meet in KCD. In that game, one of the campsite encounters is a suspicious peddler who has clearly gotten his goods from robbing nearby battlefields and/or graves. He'll try and judge whether or not you'd be the type of person to rat him out, telling you his goods might not be acquired in the traditional sense. If you say you don't care about that, he'll offer to trade with you and become significantly friendlier. I imagine if the player had already stolen from other traders (if that was to be added) or was playing as a Malefactor, the disposition of bandits would start higher than usual.

I like the suggestion of bandits not necessarily being aggressive on sight as opposed to a lot of other bandit suggestions people have put up, but I still don't know if they should be outright aggressive at all. Most humans in the game have at least heard of Seraphs before, and when travelling your main safety is in your numbers. I don't think it would be wise for a small group of bandits to go picking a fight with a tall, immortal being who can repeatedly come back after death until they finally kill all of you. Some of the new trader sets get names internally, and one that stood out to me was 'shady'. The dark cloak has this name, while there are matching pieces that don't get the 'shady' name but share the same design style. Put together, it looks like something a thief or scavenger would wear. I think this would be more fitting for a 'bandit' type group - kind of shifty, suspicious travellers who deal in interesting goods but never quite say where they got them from. Some of them would also clearly be goods that have come from other traders - trader clothing, sealed croks of food, etc. They'd probably also be eager to pawn off whatever trader goods they might have, so it can't be traced back to them by any angry trader who wonders where the embroidered shirt he hung outside to dry has vanished to. You'd probably also get regarded with suspicion, unless you were a Malefactor, in which case they might have better deals and treat you with a bit of comradery. 'Honour among thieves' and all that. Maybe offering a free small meal if you were actively starving to death, or a free bandage if you were very low on HP. Bandits should also have a much higher chance to generate wearing any of the trader masks, since they'd probably not want their identity to be known. ------------ Unrelated to the above section, but I wish the trading system was overhauled to be less restrictive. These people are struggling to survive out there (well, most of them are) but they're incredibly picky with goods. "I wanted a brown leather reinforced shield, not a green one. I won't buy that!" I think some items should just have categories instead of set definitions. Eg; a trader might buy any shield, but the price depends on the quality. Crude shield is worth the least, wooden shields would be worth more, then leather-reinforced shields, metal-plated shields and finally the tailor's ornate shields valued the highest. Same for things like falxes - if a trader is wanting to trade for a weapon, why should they care if it's bismuth or tin bronze. You should be able to sell whichever you want, and then the amount they give you for it depends on type. I also think clothing traders specifically could have a "request clothing" option like a real tailor would. They'd still have weekly rotating stock, but you could also pay extra for them to make a specific item of trader clothing for you that they aren't selling that week. It'd take the entire week to make, but would guarantee you got that item the week after. They could also potentially repair your clothes for some gears, for players who don't have linen to spare in winter or don't know that non-tailors can repair clothing too.