Automatic machines for auto-panning?

[Wizard1976]

I dont know if this has been suggested before [if it has, I apologize]

But it would be nice if there was some mechanics/machines for automatically panning sand and gravel at least.

[Maelstrom]

Check out the Useful Things mod.

[Wizard1976]

@Maelstrom I have the mod and know it adds a sluice, but I was suggesting an addition to the base game, since the game does have some automation.

Would be nice to be able to automate Boney Soil too.

[Thorfinn]

Game balance is probably why it's not in the game -- it would be far too easy to just set up a couple dozen sluices, fill the loading hoppers, empty the receiving hoppers and just hole up and let things run until you have enough tin/copper/gold/arrowheads/whatever, not bothering with the game itself. Better yet, do so on a server so you don't even get hungry while doing so. And particularly if you add mods that let you pan other materials or change the drops of existing pannables. Panning is supposed to be tedious to prevent people from setting up AFK loot farms. Sure, you can kind of do that with windmills, but they are a substantial time and materials investment, and only process materials far more scarce than sand.

[Varenvel]

On 7/8/2023 at 7:14 PM, Thorfinn said:

Game balance is probably why it's not in the game -- it would be far too easy to just set up a couple dozen sluices, fill the loading hoppers, empty the receiving hoppers and just hole up and let things run until you have enough tin/copper/gold/arrowheads/whatever, not bothering with the game itself. Better yet, do so on a server so you don't even get hungry while doing so. And particularly if you add mods that let you pan other materials or change the drops of existing pannables. Panning is supposed to be tedious to prevent people from setting up AFK loot farms. Sure, you can kind of do that with windmills, but they are a substantial time and materials investment, and only process materials far more scarce than sand.

 

you could make same point that for said reasons quern connected to windmill is op , or autohammers , devs could balance it out that its slower (like quern is or hammers) , most people would just use it to pan bone dirt (who otherwise can be very time consuming and very uninteresting gameplay wise) , i personaly not have gripes with lots of other game mechanics as they are ether waiting , or engadging (like cooking or blacksmighting) or dev could make it you cant pan sand or gravel in "sieve" or nerf drops from it

autohammers also have limits what they can forge , sieve could also limit that you can only use bone soil , or that sieving gravel and sand is very very slow

but paning is just brain dead click to collect click to pan , problem is you do want to pan as its almost only way you can get early candles , but its most "unfun" mechanic game has , having it automated but slow (windmill) would cut some of that

even with automation you would be still using a lot shovels , you would need windmill , getting large amount of sand is quite time consuming and devs could make that you get less nuggets from sand or make it slow

my main complain is in current game you do it due valuable items you get , but your trading your irl sanity for it.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Varenvel

[Thorfinn]

Fair. I misunderstood. I was basing it on how it's done in Useful Stuff, which I think is a mid-Copper Age "automation", so potentially as early as mid to late May. The balance there is that you get only one potential item per block of sand/gravel.

If you are using windmills, how does that help with early candles? Aren't you awash in beeswax by the time you can make a couple sets of sails? Unless I get insanely lucky with terra preta or saltpeter, the quickest I can get a windmill is late June or even early July.

[Maelstrom]

I've had worlds where I'm awash in linen with nary a bee until the following spring.  Sometimes world gen is a real beatch!

[Thorfinn]

I used to think that, that there simply were no bees. But as I've fired up old worlds, the bees are there; I just was not very good at finding them. Worlds I would swear had no bees turned out to have them with usually no more than a day or two search with the music and weather off, and the environmental turned all the way up. Once I find pigs and forest floor, the bees are there; I was just mistaking things like water and wind in the trees with buzzing.

There are areas where bees do not spawn, sure, just like there are places where copper does not spawn. But why would one choose to settle there? I've never failed to find a good spot with copper out the wazoo and a few bees marked on the map within 2-3 days.

[Maelstrom]

That one world was a dearth of bees.  When I found the Buzz Words mod and installed it I can now confirm there were no bees closer than the one I found; which I found by accident exploring for bauxite.  I found the bees just before winter but by the time I got the skep home, home was cold enough to make them instantly hibernate. for the winter.

[Thorfinn]

I fiddled with Buzzwords for a while, thinking it would help me figure out how to better find bees. But Buzzwords has a range of only 10 blocks, and audio a range of about 40, but practically speaking, about 30. Buzzwords also has a few second delay before it begins, so it's easy to move in a straight line through that 21 block distance without triggering any indication. By the time you are in range for Buzzwords to work at all, the audio buzz cannot be missed.  Anyways, Buzzwords will detect if you are in any of 441 blocks centered on the hive, while audio is easily in the range of any of 3721 blocks, potentially as many as 6561 blocks. So somewhere between 9 and 16 times as effective. Plus all that stopping to wait a few beats for the effect to register is dangerous, maybe the most dangerous act in the game, since bears will sneak up on you in the meantime. Relying on Buzzwords is usually going to fail, IME.

I was toying with loading up Block Overlay, but, realistically, since the sound fades to essentially nil after about 40 blocks, I doubt I will be able to improve much on the 30 or so block distance I can pretty easily hear over the other environment sounds and my footsteps.

[EDIT]

Thinking about the asymmetry of beehives in seeing flowers made me start a new game and seek a hive, which came up before 11AM. Anyway, it, too is asymmetrical. You get audio 40 blocks south of the hive, but only 30 blocks north. It's also 40 east, but only 33 west. But there were rifts and water and caves with drifters and an F5 tornado going on, so I might not have pinned it down exactly. Plus, it was more or less flat ground, only a few Z difference, but there was a huge difference in terms of intervening foliage, in case that makes any difference. If anyone thinks its worth bothering with, figuring that out would be a whole lot easier in creative. Just pop down a hive at origin and see.

[/EDIT]

[EDIT2]

I'm not saying you are wrong. Just that I used to be very, very wrong about the exact same thing. Pigs and the right kind of forest has never failed me since I realized there was some kind of correlation there.

[/EDIT2]

 

Edited July 14, 2023 by Thorfinn

[Maelstrom]

Thank you for the insight about piggu's and forest combinations being a good indicator of the presence of the bees.  I'd ask for more details but realized that we've dragged this discussion off topic.

[Moon_Dew]

There's already a sieve in-game but, so far, its only use is for making parchment (at least according to the wiki).  Perhaps we could use that for faster panning or something similar?

[hgbguy]

i kinda wonder if it should just be made more engaging to do panning like imagine a sort of lil minigame where you have the pan infront of you and you wasd to tilt the board and if you tilt it in the right direction quickly you can get more done and later on maybe there could be a waterwheel. however that would require rivers that actually run and a whole new mechanic but something similar to the windmill and quern that takes investment. that way early on hand panning is engaging to do and later on slower but automatic panning can come when you have the resources. i think that would probably solve the issue of the braindead feeling and maybe the automation would take so long that you don't get as much hand panning and balance it out that way.

i feel like at the least the tilting game would make the hand panning not such a drag like you might just do it for the enjoyment of tilting the pan at some point yknow just intrinsic fun. on the flip side i guess that doing that might make getting nothing more frustrating so maybe not.

then i figured maybe it could drop more but have a different limiting factor like polluting the water so you need to wait until its cleared to pan again. i suppose with the way you can just move water that doesn't stop much. ah dammit

every idea i come up with i also come up with a problem i just want panning to be more fun like maybe the default is you always at least get a stone or a flint that way you always get at least something but rarer items come less often but are a nice surprise like you might just be panning for stones for a stone wall or flint for tools and then you get a nice surprise etc different tiers of rarity like arrowheads and gold bits are rarest etc something like that clay and copper are mid rarity and stones and flint are almost always etc.

anyway what do any of you guys think about these ideas.