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Sea salt from ocean/salt water


Kosti

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Currently one can only get salt by mining which is realistic, but what isn't realistic is ocean and salt waters killing my crops while being 100% useless!!!

While I understand this may not be a priority right now, I believe it's something that should be in the game, especially if it can kill crops since right now that water is just useless. Especially also since finding salt is pretty much harder than reaching the iron age unless one gets extremely lucky.

Have ocean/salt water be dryable during summer/hot seasons/climates. To dry it have at maximum 4x4 pool of player placed ocean water on top of packed dirt in a pool shape (prevents natural drying up and gives a use for packed dirt besides making a starter house). Wait for it like you wait for berries let's say around 9 days if it's 4x4 and like 7.5 days for 3x3, 6 days for 2x2, you get the point. Basically it takes a month (if its not raining) for the water to dry (while rain won't reset the process it will stop the drying while it's raining and continue once the rain passes, placing blocks on top to prevent rain will also stop the process as they need sunlight and hot temperature to dry) After it's dried up, use a bucket to remove the dry water (which is practically now just normal water (this also gives a way to make normal water on ocean worlds)) Removing the dry water leaves the exposed salt crystals. (Exposed salt crystals will be in a state like charcoal, however with only up to 3 layers max per a dryed up block and 1 minimum layer)

The exposed salt crystals need about 24 hours without rain, however, regardless of temperature or season, just no rain (rain will stop and this time reset the process) to solidify into solidified salt crystals (placing blocks over them will allow them to solidify even with rain, unlike when drying water). Exposed salt crystals can still be harvested (right click) but upon cleaning them, the player will loose them, so unless they store them for mass solidifying, they are completely useless. Once done, the now solidified salt crystals must first be cleaned with a pan (click with a pan on a solidified salt crystal on the ground and clean/wash it in the water) this will finally give a salt crystal. (solidified salt crystals can be stored outside even during rain.) Now to refine the salt, the salt crystals must first be crushed with a hammer in the inventory (I think being a complex process is very important as early game/copper age even early bronze age having easy access to salt practically removes the scare of winter preservation.) which gives us salt chunks. Salt chunks must then be ran through a quern, the output of which is finally sea salt.

Basically: Ocean/salt water -> dry -> exposed salt crystals -> solidify (like drying) -> solidified salt crystals -> pan (cleaning/washing) -> salt crystals -> crush with hammer -> salt chunks -> quern -> sea salt.

I won't say specific values, but I suggest a single exposed salt crystals layer = single solidified salt crystals = single salt crystal. This means at minimum (if u are the most unlucky person) you get from 4x4 16 salt crystals, and if u have insane luck (like actually insane as i suggest 3 layers max is super rare) you get 48 salt at a maximum which is near impossible. A middle ground is around 25 salt crystals per 4x4. These salt crystals then give each two salt chunks, so around 50 salt chunks per one 4x4 drying, and each salt chunk makes a single sea salt. Around 50 sea salt per 4x4.

I believe all of this is a fair way to make a reasonable ammount of salt, but more importantly have a mechanic in game that should exist as well as make a realistic way to get salt for mid-late game which is at that point not OP but also not useless.

https://www.cheethamsalt.com.au/uploads/media/Saltmadeprocess-1601970217.jpg

Here is an image of the real-life process. It's not a complete 1-1, but imo this way makes much more sense in game. A seraph doesn't really care if his salt is sieved into a particular size or not so long as he can use it to pickle.

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On 10/27/2024 at 5:17 PM, Krougal said:

There's a mod: https://mods.vintagestory.at/fieldsofsalt

Although honestly, once you find 1 salt pillar, you are set for life, so I haven't bothered trying it out.

 

fair enough, but I do feel like adding functionality is somewhat nessecary + having a way to make normal water on ocean worlds is still a massive +

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3 minutes ago, Kosti said:

fair enough, but I do feel like adding functionality is somewhat nessecary + having a way to make normal water on ocean worlds is still a massive +

Yeah, and if I got far enough into the game where I felt the need and hadn't found salt yet, I would make use of it.

The need mainly comes to make pickles for cheese, but sheep are such a goddawful pain in the ass that I can't be bothered most of the time, and sylvite is real nice to get your hands on (only generates in halite).

 

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3 minutes ago, Krougal said:

Yeah, and if I got far enough into the game where I felt the need and hadn't found salt yet, I would make use of it.

The need mainly comes to make pickles for cheese, but sheep are such a goddawful pain in the ass that I can't be bothered most of the time, and sylvite is real nice to get your hands on (only generates in halite).

 

Heard that end-game players min-max their health through the food system for best health 🤔 tho goats really are a pain😂

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Just now, Kosti said:

Heard that end-game players min-max their health through the food system for best health 🤔 tho goats really are a pain😂

Oh yeah, it is worthwhile. Just the other 4 gives you 10 HP, the dairy will add another 2.5.

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I'd be all for this. i play on an island map with no access to saltpetre at all, so I'm completely lacking good K-type fertilizer, and have no access to pickling or any other system that requires salt. and I'm sitting right next to the ocean.

Being able to make use of that would be lovely.

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Other than the evaporation basin should be more or less impermeable (rock, clay, etc., maybe wood gates) sounds good. There is a mod (Fields of Salt (?)) that works kind of like that, but IIRC the basin takes some insane materials. Maybe rework that?

[EDIT]

Thinking about it, the game is moving away from being able to transport source blocks. It might even be moving away from source blocks entirely. While your idea would still work in HS and Standard, it will probably be obsolete in a version or two. Changing the ponding materials from the other mod wouldn't be too bad, but I don't think I'd put much more effort into it than that at the moment.

If salt is that big of a deal, I'd use Expanded Foods. If that's way more content than you want, maybe ask @l33tmaan if he would create a stripped down Expanded Foods Lite that contains only basic operations like berry drying, salt making, etc. The kinds of things that are requested frequently.

Edited by Thorfinn
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22 hours ago, Krougal said:

Oh yeah, it is worthwhile. Just the other 4 gives you 10 HP, the dairy will add another 2.5.

ehh, idk if it's worth the 2.5 HP, ig when we get harder dungeons and bosses it will be though

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2 hours ago, Thorfinn said:

Other than the evaporation basin should be more or less impermeable (rock, clay, etc., maybe wood gates) sounds good. There is a mod (Fields of Salt (?)) that works kind of like that, but IIRC the basin takes some insane materials. Maybe rework that?

[EDIT]

Thinking about it, the game is moving away from being able to transport source blocks. It might even be moving away from source blocks entirely. While your idea would still work in HS and Standard, it will probably be obsolete in a version or two. Changing the ponding materials from the other mod wouldn't be too bad, but I don't think I'd put much more effort into it than that at the moment.

If salt is that big of a deal, I'd use Expanded Foods. If that's way more content than you want, maybe ask @l33tmaan if he would create a stripped down Expanded Foods Lite that contains only basic operations like berry drying, salt making, etc. The kinds of things that are requested frequently.

I mean considering they are planning to eventually add oceans/big seas in regular mode, i don't think source blocks going away will ever end the ammount of water for salt, though I do wonder how they plan to entirely move from source blocks, especially with things like rain, I feel like if they were to do that it'd cause a lot of lag

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1 hour ago, Maelstrom said:

Fortunately, expanded foods leaves base game food mechanics alone so using the entire mod is a use what you want, leave alone what you don't.

I'll look at that, thanks!

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1 hour ago, Maelstrom said:

Fortunately, expanded foods leaves base game food mechanics alone so using the entire mod is a use what you want, leave alone what you don't.

Sure. Though EF makes a pretty serious hit on performance, which can push a marginal system into insufficient.

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18 minutes ago, Kosti said:

i don't think source blocks going away will ever end the ammount of water for salt, though I do wonder how they plan to entirely move from source blocks, especially with things like rain, I feel like if they were to do that it'd cause a lot of lag

No, there will still be plenty of water for salt. In fact, as currently implemented, it wouldn't reduce it at all. Have you looked at how 1.20 deals with non-source transfer yet? I's more of a non-flowing flowing block, if that makes sense. Like a water flow block if you block off access to the source. It just drains into the substrate, whatever that substrate is.

Rather than source blocks, I think the future is more correcting the flow characteristics to make that more realistic. The problem is, that will make griefing that much easier to do, and that much harder to fix. Dam off a river and you could flood out a players valley and house before he logs back in, unless the game also has infinite sinks.

[EDIT]

Have you played The Planet Crafter? The griefing I'm talking about is what happened to everyone who did not read spoilers ahead of time. If you build in a swale, there may be no way to dry it out.

I don't think rain is going to make any difference. Could, I guess, but I would have dirt blocks be infinite water sinks and it is no longer a problem, apart from caves. Best way would probably not to bother with runoff at all, but rather just that some containers can catch rain.

Edited by Thorfinn
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41 minutes ago, Thorfinn said:

Dam off a river and you could flood out a players valley and house before he logs back in

That would be awesome! I'd laugh my ass off even if I were the victim of a prank using such a feat of engineering.

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