Prospecting is a broken system being replaced by mods. Let’s fix it.

[Thorfinn]

Magnetite is a pain, to be sure, because while other ores get at least one roll during the ore generation phase of worldgen, any given iron prospect might get 0 rolls. Probably a compensation for it being so huge it would be hard to miss if it followed the same rules as other ore bodies.

Iron is one of those it's much more efficient to just go spelunking once you get a decent reading, because if it's there, the cave will almost certainly cut through the body somewhere. Another is chromite, because it's so doggone rare, and you need so little of it. The cave can wipe out pretty much the whole thing and you still have enough.

[Echo Weaver]

2 hours ago, Professor Dragon said:

Or to build into the game some type of improvement along those lines, such as being able to sample a small square and have it give you a Node like correct answer, but for the full vertical column.

Better Prospecting seems to do this and some other stuff on your wishlist: https://mods.vintagestory.at/bettererprospecting

[Echo Weaver]

I think this comes down to having differing expectations of the game. I don't expect it to move quickly. I want reason to explore. As @LadyWYT said, I think the time and effort is about right for the kind of game I want to be playing. Advancement feels like an achievement.

41 minutes ago, Thorfinn said:

Magnetite is a pain, to be sure, because while other ores get at least one roll during the ore generation phase of worldgen, any given iron prospect might get 0 rolls

I didn't know that. I bet that's the source of the repeated failures on high readings. I do think I found iron on my third try. That just didn't violate my expectations.

[Rexvladimir]

Guys, this discussion is starting to get derailed, so I’ll make this my final point. The title of this post is being proven true—even within this thread, many people are advocating for one mod or another. As I stated: “Prospecting is a broken system being replaced by mods. Let’s fix it.”

It’s also really disappointing to hear someone mention that players are resorting to x-ray mods out of frustration with prospecting. That alone says a lot. “Prospect Together” is one of the top 30 most downloaded mods of all time out of thousands of available mods. I wouldn’t be surprised if many people in this very discussion are using it right now. That clearly proves my point.

If you have a better way of fixing prospecting, please share it. I don’t believe my solution is 100% perfect, nor am I saying there isn’t a better one out there. But as of right now, I haven’t seen anything posted here that improves upon it. The general consensus so far seems to be either: “Deal with it because I did, so you can too,” or “Just mod it with this.”

That said, I do appreciate the engagement on this topic and genuinely hope that through this discussion, a better system can be created for all of our benefit.

[LadyWYT]

1 hour ago, Rexvladimir said:

“Prospect Together” is one of the top 30 most downloaded mods of all time out of thousands of available mods. I wouldn’t be surprised if many people in this very discussion are using it right now. That clearly proves my point.

I will note that while a friend and I use that mod on our server, that's so we can share prospecting data with each other, not because the prospecting system itself is hard. Aside from the data sharing, the mechanics are pretty much the exact same as vanilla...and that's including the heat map. With this mod, the heat map just becomes a grid rather than colored dots.

[OBAMFSpike]

I'll have an unpopular opinion at best but thats okay. After having had spent some years actually sluicing and running high bankers and dredges and physically looking for gold and other minerals, id say leave it all how it is, it's spot on.

Mind dizzying hand blistering nonsense. Am I rich yet?

NOPE! XD

[OBAMFSpike]

On 9/15/2025 at 7:35 PM, Entaris said:

You want prospecting? Ladies and gentlemen, I give you prospecting. 

This is what im talking about.

[Crunchy Chicken]

I hate prospecting with a passion, I use both Prospecting Together and Better Prospecting at the same time. Having the game calculate what is actually in a chunk instead of possibilities + having the option to check what's straight down in a single line under me, all the way to the mantle to determine where the ores are before I start digging is a game changer. My friends also use both of them, none of us will play with vanilla prospecting at all, if we are forced to do that we go much like you into creative to speedrun finding ores. Your proposal would be a simple thing to solve a lot of issues with it honestly.

Prospecting is by far the worst mechanic in the game and it's not even close, because the rest of them I can at most nitpick - prospecting is just crap. The theory behind it is fun but the implementation calls for a vengeance of the heavens. I hope it will be reworked at some point, for now God bless the modders.

[Krougal]

Ok, I thought Prospecting together doesn't actually work properly (other than sharing data); in as far as the data it displays is bullshit because the game doesn't work that way.

 

[Thorfinn]

12 hours ago, Rexvladimir said:

As I stated: “Prospecting is a broken system being replaced by mods. Let’s fix it.”

That's your assertion, I know. Some people who have different expectations of the game think as you do. But look at the downloads counts and you see a very different picture. ProspectTogether is one of the most popular, yet at its peak, only 32k downloads. That does NOT mean 32k people wanted the mod. It might mean nothing more than 32k instances checked out a server that used it. I know I am several of those 32k. Others, like BetterProspecting are more likely to be a higher fraction of single-player, people who deliberately chose the mod because they thought the system was "broken", yet its 22k downloads are over all versions, all instances, since 1.19.5. The number of individuals is likely less than 20% of that figure.

All you are seeing is that the people who don't like it are not shy about saying so. Kinda like society in general. Most people are decent, just trying to live their lives as they like. The number of shrieking activists is actually pretty small. It's just that they are so very loud, and so very in-your-face, that they seem much more commonplace.

12 hours ago, Rexvladimir said:

It’s also really disappointing to hear someone mention that players are resorting to x-ray mods out of frustration with prospecting. That alone says a lot.

I think what it says is that people have differing standards for what they think is fun. Stimulating. The high time preference BLUF and TL;DR types want something that tells them exactly where to dig. The amount of hand-holding each person wants within that category also varies widely. The same thing happened with all the sound and fury about calcined flint.

Please don't dismiss us as saying, "Just deal with it." That's not what we are saying. Some of us think it's fine, or even too much of a participation trophy already. There's nothing wrong with wanting an easy mode. So install one. Don't try to force easy mode on everyone just because it's your preference. 

[Echo Weaver]

12 hours ago, Rexvladimir said:

Guys, this discussion is starting to get derailed, so I’ll make this my final point. The title of this post is being proven true—even within this thread, many people are advocating for one mod or another. As I stated: “Prospecting is a broken system being replaced by mods. Let’s fix it.”

Except that half of the people on the thread reject your premise.

Mods are there for a reason. If the goal is to enjoy the game, use them. Don't try to make everyone play like you.

Anyway, the devs know what's going on, and they've been active in adjusting systems that fail to meet the difficulty they're going for.

Edited September 17, 2025 by Echo Weaver

[Echo Weaver]

18 hours ago, Echo Weaver said:

Oh, I see. I think it's parts per thousand. The actual notation is 0/00 rather than what's used in the game %%. That's why I couldn't Google it. Seems like one could have used an extended unicode character or something.

OH, in those screenshots, the notation IS 0/00. I could have sworn it was %% when I last looked, and I even remember another thread about it. So maybe they fixed it.

[Thorfinn]

Per mille is properly ‰, which I think is what the game used, though with my failing eyesight, I wouldn't swear to it. Often people use %% as shorthand, because it's easier than entering the unicode.

[EDIT]

Alt-0137 on the keypad, for those who care. 

Edited September 19, 2025 by Thorfinn

[Entaris]

10 hours ago, OBAMFSpike said:

I'll have an unpopular opinion at best but thats okay. After having had spent some years actually sluicing and running high bankers and dredges and physically looking for gold and other minerals, id say leave it all how it is, it's spot on.

Mind dizzying hand blistering nonsense. Am I rich yet?

NOPE! XD

Hahaha, my man! See, the rockhounds know.

 

I hate placer, myself, but I'm more into silver right now anyway.

[Entaris]

14 hours ago, Rexvladimir said:

The general consensus so far seems to be either: “Deal with it because I did, so you can too,” or “Just mod it with this.”

That's a little reductive, don't you think?

What I'm seeing is people who are not experiencing your particular problems with prospecting, and ones that are suggesting interim fixes until such a time as VS has a rehash of the prospecting systems.

[LadyWYT]

1 hour ago, Echo Weaver said:

Mods are there for a reason. If the goal is to enjoy the game, use them. Don't try to make everyone play like you.

Well said. This is pretty much the reason that at least half the time, the general veteran reaction to most suggestions is "That would be great as a mod, but not for the base game". Though the devs also said it best in the FAQ:

Quote

Why did you add Feature X instead of Y? Feature Z is annoying, why don't you remove it? Why is my Feedback not being listened to?
We are serving a very large player base, each with their own unique vision of how the game should be like. Particularly with survival sandbox games, the vision of players can vary greatly. This is why we offer immense customization options right from within the game as well as invested a lot of time&effort into making the game moddable for those cases where we cannot offer easy customization. Many of the changes we do inevitably will please one portion of our players and displease another portion. There is also our own strong vision of how the game should be and play like - if we were to ignore that, we would very quickly loose motivation to continue developing. Some changes might only bring benefits, but only addresses a very niche case - so its always a trade off on the amount of work being put into versus the amount of gain a change brings. Our development time is a finite resource that we have to carefully allocate to achieve the most in the least amount of time. In short, it is not possible for us to accomodate everyone's wishes. That being said we do try our best to listen to the needs and wishes of our community!

Link: https://www.vintagestory.at/faq.html/

1 hour ago, Thorfinn said:

I think what it says is that people have differing standards for what they think is fun. Stimulating. The high time preference BLUF and TL;DR types want something that tells them exactly where to dig. The amount of hand-holding each person wants within that category also varies widely. The same thing happened with all the sound and fury about calcined flint.

Please don't dismiss us as saying, "Just deal with it." That's not what we are saying. Some of us think it's fine, or even too much of a participation trophy already. There's nothing wrong with wanting an easy mode. So install one. Don't try to force easy mode on everyone just because it's your preference. 

Pretty much this too. 

[Rexvladimir]

Another fine example of the broken prospecting system. I prospected this right in front of the iron vein. Yet it shows as yellow. With no proper indication that iron is here had I been looking for it. 

Second number means nothing, why is it even there? Just saying that it is "parts per million" means nothing to the average player. 

This world was created in patch 1.21.0 so it is not a outdated world issue. 

 

Will continue posting fine examples like this. 

[Echo Weaver]

Did the propick in node search not tell you that you were getting close to range of hematite? That sounds like a bug.

Otherwise, "decent" means decent. I don't see a problem. This is how probability works. There is no definite indicator in the probability search mode, only node search.

Also, I know what per mille is. I just didn't know the symbol for it.

Edited September 21, 2025 by Echo Weaver

[Rexvladimir]

This one makes me laugh it doesn't even show that copper was an option as i am standing in front of it. 

Also the Tin ore reading was wrong and it was pretty large, not "very poor"

Edited September 21, 2025 by Rexvladimir

[Rexvladimir]

18 minutes ago, Echo Weaver said:

Did the propick in node search not tell you that you were getting close to range of hematite? That sounds like a bug.

Otherwise, "decent" means decent. I don't see a problem. This is how probability works. There is no definite indicator in the probability search mode, only node search.

Also, I know what per mille is. I just didn't know the symbol for it.

1. I was standing right in front of it, and that was the reading as stated. From now on to further my point i will screen shot the ore and the reading just to further prove how broken this system is.

2. I still adamantly disagree with you that the system is “good” under probability. The reading needs to guarantee ore in that chunk, not just suggest a chance.

3. You have over 700 posts on the forums and respond to almost everything. You are not the average player, as I pointed out in my post. The average player is told by almost every guide to ignore that number.

And let’s be honest — even in this very thread, you didn’t know it was parts per mille. “Oh, I see. I think it’s parts per thousand. The actual notation is 0/00 rather than what’s used in the game %%. That’s why I couldn’t Google it. Seems like one could have used an extended Unicode character or something.”

So please, keep the survival bias out of this discussion and look at the facts. Even you didn’t know what that number meant until Kyassady explained it. Personally, I don’t even know if they’re right — but since I don’t know either, I have to go with their explanation. Meaning the system is broken and doesn’t work as intended and is being replaced by mods. 

[Echo Weaver]

32 minutes ago, Rexvladimir said:

I still adamantly disagree with you that the system is “good” under probability. The reading needs to guarantee ore in that chunk, not just suggest a chance.

You're free to do so, but posting more examples isn't going to help because you haven't been convincing that probability is bad. You just don't like it.

33 minutes ago, Rexvladimir said:

You have over 700 posts on the forums and respond to almost everything. You are not the average player, as I pointed out in my post. The average player is told by almost every guide to ignore that number.

I think I'm about as close to the average player as you're going to get on a forum dedicated to the game. If your target audience is people who don't care enough about a game to hang out on its forum, you're in the wrong place.

34 minutes ago, Rexvladimir said:

So please, keep the survival bias out of this discussion and look at the facts.

Here's a thought - please stop using technical terms you don't understand to talk down to people who disagree with you.

[Rexvladimir]

23 minutes ago, Echo Weaver said:

Here's a thought - please stop using technical terms you don't understand to talk down to people who disagree with you.

You have failed at every turn to combat my arguments and ignore my points to focus on smaller parts/points while ignoring the main point. I have provided proof after proof yet you conveniently choose to ignore those and only focus on the things you can respond to. Still not going to mention the lack of a copper reading even showing up in the prospecting picture above while standing right in front of it? How about the bad cassiterite reading while right in front of it and it being a big chunk while the reading said "very poor"? Not going to mention the fact that you just learned about parts per milli in this very thread but still want to act like the expert? Yeah, YOU have survival bias. "I played the game this way just fine thus everyone else has to as well and if they don't like it that way go download a mod." That mentality is a great way to keep something niche. 

Unlike you I do know what I am arguing and will continue to prove my point as more examples appear. 

The fact that you think the AVERAGE person would ever visit a forum just further proves my point. You respond to almost every suggestion forum post made. That is not average. The average player buys the game, plays the game, quits the game. If they end up on a forum it is because someone post a guide that they were googling. Steam charts prove this with the amount of people that buy a game compared to the amount of people in a reddit for the game or the forums/steam discussion tab of that game. But I guess under your logic games like Balders gate 3, RimWorld, Satisfactory, Factorio, Schedule 1, Hades, Undertale, Terraria, Star Dew Valley, and Minecraft don't have people who love/are passionate about the game because they don't visit the forums. Developers that do target forum post users will always create a niche game and never branch out into main stream because of it. The forums only objective is to foster a strong core community (not the target audience) and bring potential problems to the developers attention. I would like to see this game as a great alternative to Minecraft or as my wife and I jokingly call it "adult Minecraft". That will never occur with the current main progression system being so obscure. 

Anyway go ahead and make your response, However, I have nothing further to discuss with you about this topic. I will continue pushing this topic for a good prospecting change to make it a more beneficial system for not just myself but every other current player, new player, and even you.

Best of luck in your forum crusade "average player".

[LadyWYT]

2 hours ago, Echo Weaver said:

Did the propick in node search not tell you that you were getting close to range of hematite? That sounds like a bug.

Otherwise, "decent" means decent. I don't see a problem. This is how probability works.

I mean, this encapsulates my strategy quite well, and it's served me well in my time in the game. The density search I use to get a good idea of where I want to dig. The node search will tell me what goodies are actually there. Most of the time, there are goodies in the shaft, and most of the time they're also the goodies I was looking for. There's been a time or two I didn't get what I was after, and there's been a few times where I found something that wasn't listed in the density search--those are what I call "happy accidents". In the very worst case scenario, I just end up needing to dig an extra shaft or two to find what I'm after, which generally equates to around an extra ten-fifteen minutes of work or so per shaft...small potatoes in the grand scheme of the game. 

[Echo Weaver]

3 hours ago, Rexvladimir said:

I will continue pushing this topic for a good prospecting change to make it a more beneficial system for not just myself but every other current player, new player, and even you

Yup. And you know what everyone needs far better than they know themselves. You speak not only for me, who thinks you are wrong, but for everyone who is not here who you've never spoken to. Gotcha.

Perhaps this would have been an interesting conversation if you'd had any interest in sharing ideas rather than just complimenting yourself.

[Entaris]

The thing is, "gold is where you find it"

All the mapping systems and all the geology knowledge in the world can tell you "It uh...SHOULD be here at X in Y quantity" but until you get in and start breaking and licking rocks, you're not going to know, due to how surface mineral occurrences...well, occur. Hydrothermals, especially.

 

That's what the propick system tries to emulate, even though it doesn't have a mineralogical occurrence system outside of "X mineral coincides with Y host rock"

 

Personally, I'd love a mineral injection model using the 1, 3, 7, 21 method around intrusions.