Really questionable changes in 1.22 pre1

[Feycat]

On 2/8/2026 at 7:32 PM, LadyWYT said:

Just to be clear, this isn't a call to nerf or buff particular classes. But those numbers are why I think 8 ranged damage even for a high tier spear is a bit much. Like I said before, I'd rather see the spear be a solid general purpose weapon but not the best pick, than have specific classes get nerfed or buffed.

My point is that nerfing spears IS a nerf to hunters by definition. 

[LadyWYT]

11 minutes ago, Feycat said:

My point is that nerfing spears IS a nerf to hunters by definition. 

Fair enough. However, in hindsight I do think hunters were a little strong before due to how the spear was balanced.

After tinkering around some more in 1.22-pre2 I'm more inclined to say that the spear damage could be bumped back up a bit without issue, since the major balancing factor now is the time it takes to charge one for firing. It's about twice as long as before, which means that the spear can't be rapid-fired. That slower charge time should also make it harder to fire while moving. I do think though, that the highest tier spears(iron and steel) shouldn't be doing as much base damage as the old bronze, at least not without one instance of quenching/tempering. As I understand it the first quench is risk-free, so the player putting in a little extra effort to make a good weapon a great weapon doesn't really hurt. 

Overall, right now I'm thinking that the spear will be a solid general-purpose weapon that's most ideal for hunting, softening up a target at range before engaging in melee, or otherwise poking at a target from a safe spot. For firing multiple shots in rapid succession, or firing while moving, the bow will be much more ideal. For hunters specifically, they'll still remain strong at range, but may want to switch between bow and spear depending on whether they're hunting animals, or fighting monsters. They'll still be a favorite pick due to strong traits and being easy to play, but they may not be overshadowing all the other classes quite as much as before.

[Vexxvididu]

2 hours ago, RogueVali said:

That's funny, cause reason we got falx not normal swords is because of the rot beasts, no? Something about how there's metal in their veins, and normal weapons don work too good, hence the adjusted falx blade that can really damage them? Ye it doesn't really feel like it does, huh.

Yeah, that's what I was driving at.  their damage numbers seem lower than they should be....  though I admit I need to look more into the "tier" system.

[CastIronFabric]

16 minutes ago, Vexxvididu said:

Yeah, that's what I was driving at.  their damage numbers seem lower than they should be....  though I admit I need to look more into the "tier" system.

I am not sure how many people have read my comment regarding my game play so forgive me if you have.

With my settings in previous versions I kill a pig in 3 hits with a copper spear.

In the release candidate (with the exact same world settings) I killed a pig with 2 hits with a copper spear the first time and 3 hits with a copper spear the second time. The first time both hits where while crouched which is why I think it was different.

 

Edited February 13 by CastIronFabric

[LadyWYT]

9 minutes ago, Vexxvididu said:

Yeah, that's what I was driving at.  their damage numbers seem lower than they should be....  though I admit I need to look more into the "tier" system.

To my knowledge the tier system doesn't apply outside of PvP and calculating how much damage a player should take from a creature's attack, since NPC opponents rely on health and not armor or blocking. Against NPCs, it's the raw damage output of the weapon that matters, so whatever deals the highest damage per hit and can be swung/fired quickly is going to be the best when it comes to fighting.

I think the damage for the falx is fine, and actually expect the damage output to be better than previous game versions thanks to the new quenching/tempering and sharpening system. I think the falx might currently be the only weapon that can be sharpened as well, which means that it's currently the only weapon that can perform critical hits.

Quote

• Feature: Tool buffing system with the grinding wheel
  • Added grinding wheel to sharpen bladed weapons
  • A sharpened weapon adds a critical hit chance, at the cost of durability. A critical hit is +100% damage

Based on that, I'm thinking that falxs could potentially land the strongest hits of any weapon, but at the cost of needing to actually engage in melee combat as well as sacrificing some weapon durability to keep the weapon sharp. It will likely also rely somewhat on RNG, in that a critical hit will actually need to be triggered. 

Thus my current expectation is that ranged and melee weapons will end up fairly evenly matched. Melee will probably have more damage potential based on the sharpening mechanic paired with the quenching and tempering, but will require the players to put themselves at risk in melee combat, as well as actually put in the effort to forge the weapon properly. Ranged damage might not have the same damage potential, but the damage done by ranged weapons will be smoother, less reliant on RNG and keep the player safer since the player will be able to more easily kill most targets before they can counter-attack.

[Bruno Willis]

On 2/11/2026 at 11:56 AM, CastIronFabric said:

I think maybe if a person who has done some real hunting that would be best indicator rather than my observations of real wildlife given where I live and I see it every day.

To derail the argument for a second, (and I think the thread has moved on a bit since I started this one but oh well) I've hunted a fair bit, and the story about the deer being hit, walking a bit, and then dyeing sounds quite possible. 

If you shoot an animal with a decent gun, it will die. The question is how far it will run/where will it hide before it does die. If you don't hit an animal's heart/lungs it can run kilometers before dying, so a lot of hunters will aim to hit an animal through the shoulder, just above the heart, where the big veins to the brain are. If they miss, they hit it's lungs or break it's front legs so it can't escape. With small animals, like rabbits, I've shot at a rabbit, missed, and it dropped dead from the surprise. Realistically small animals wouldn't survive any hit from any weapon, what-so-ever. Hares are a bit tougher, but an arrow or spear to the body would kill them, no two ways about it. 

If I were to improve hunting, I'd add a hitbox in the center of animal's chests, at about shoulder height, which would be an instant kill if hit. It'd be small enough to be a challenge, but wouldn't change size with animal, so that it would be easier to instant-kill a goat than a moose, and almost guaranteed to instant kill a hare. Pigs might need to be a special case, where the instant-kill box is only available from the front (cause I believe wild pigs are pretty unkillable unless stabbed through the heart). On a side note, headshots are not really a sensible option hunting IRL: it's easier to miss, and even if you hit, you have to hit the brain, and even then, with an arrow or spear that might not be instantly fatal. Animals can run a good way before their body realizes it's dead. 

This should maybe be a separate thread, but it's a late response to something from earlier. Ignore if necessary. 

Edited February 13 by Bruno Willis
Time's moved on since I started writing.

[MKMoose]

10 hours ago, RogueVali said:

And u can see it just as easily dismissed by the echo chamber of like 4 voices. Each thousands of comments on their accs, curious why that is. I can only hope at least some of the criticisim will get acknowledged by the devs.

Keep in mind the confounding factor in this specific discussion that is the hostile attitude of the OP. Insults, overgeneralizations and other bad-faith arguments are no way to give feedback to the devs, because it's pointless noise which distracts from the issues that should be focused on. I can practically guarantee (based on the reactions to other posts on related topics) that rewording several of the OP's points (and a few of your own, for that matter) to be more constructive and respectful would lead plenty of people here to agree with them, but alas.

 

4 hours ago, RogueVali said:

8 hours ago, LadyWYT said:

I think the damage for the falx is fine

Just everything is fine to you, isn't it..

The whole game is quite fine. Plenty of people have been enjoying it as is, even without mods. And it's ultimately still very much a work-in-progress, so less developed systems are easily seen as simply not improved yet. If the current version is heavily lacking, then going a couple versions back it could as well be a barebones prototype, but it's clearly moving forward ever closer to the devs' vision with plenty of community feedback being addressed along the way as well. Both hunting and combat seem like they will reach critical mass sooner or later and have to be addressed, but they're not a great priority as of now. Tyron has expressed interest in improving hunting, and has said that their current core team doesn't really have the right interests and experience to deliver a deep combat rework.

Regarding the falx, in the current balance of the game there's nothing really that wrong with it, ergo, it's fine. It's better than a spear for melee, but spears can still be optimal for hunting or general versatility. Spears will also most likely be buffed back up somewhat before 1.22 hits stable, considering the doubled windup time in pre.2. Enemies having no armor tiers is something of a missed opportunity to introduce deeper tradeoffs between weapon types, and suggestions to do just that have seen positive reactions.

Edited February 13 by MKMoose