CastIronFabric

1. I did not say 'bother you'. try again. I literally said the exact opposite for 'bother'. you are saying its a major ATTRACTION I think I am nearly done interacting with you on this. EDIT: I am saying this to be as honest as I can and as non-rude as I can but I think we are done, I am sorry but this is not going to go well so lets cut it off now.

On the first quote: I just do not believe you that feature we have described (monsters spawning in your base area and lighting distracting you) in this game huge motivator for you compared to other games. sorry I am not going to buy that at any price, I am immutable on that so moving on. On the second quote: I am trying to explain to you that random encounters while traveling in D&D is fundamentally not what I am talking about because its actually NOT an interruption in the way I am describing it.

1. I approve of the approach of 'going to the danger' rather than the danger coming to your base. aka..RA, so I very much approve of a approach to adventure like the RA provides. 2. So you are saying one of the major compelling reasons you like VS over PC is because monsters spawn around your base and interrupt your work even though they really do not impact your game play and are more of an annoyance like ants? Maybe I misunderstand but to be frank, if you are making that assertion I do not believe it. I have never seen in video or on multiplayer anyone ever do anything other than basically 'hold on a second let me smash these guys and we will get back to what we are doing' as nothing more than a distraction. 3. wandering encounters is NOT the same 'interruptions' I am speaking of in my mind. When you hit that trail you are ready, you are set, you are planning for an attack. When you are building a home, your mind is in deep on the design of the house, you are thinking of where what goes your head is in a different space which is why I am trying to illustrate the difference clearly with great difficulty Regarding mods for the solution of deeds to be frank, I just rather set all hostiles to passive and I am all set. I am just blueskying how I think game design should work even though I personally have a way around it. I also completely refuse to have TP instability telling me where I can and can not build, I aint having any of that on my own personal game

Basically, goat domestication to max gen takes longer than a major update in which you will want to restart anyway. and I am actually ok with that, but I used to play Wurm so I aint right in the head of course

I think we are all getting WAY ahead of ourselves. The balance I am sure is subject to change during the rc phase, that is in part the entire point of a 'early access' approach. I think its best to wait until playing the rc and see how the balance feels before making decisions on very nuanced changes

1. ok, you do not use cooper weapons and rusts are not a threat even before 5 hours, proving my underling point. I find it hard to believe that you prefer Vintage Story over Planet Crafters BECAUSE of drifters spawning in your base area or BECAUSE TP storms are mandatory. do you see my point yet? My underling point contains three features and ONLY three features in question (these are the only features I consider to be 'interuptions' in respect to what I am talking about). its exclusively only these three aspects. Perhaps I should have mentioned that from the start. A. monster spawns in bases B. TP storms mandatory C. animals attacking you in the forest So in the context of VS vs PC I find it hard to believe that the REASON you like VS more the PC is specifically because of those three aspects of the game 2. ok, so having Deeds and having the point of Deeds is to not have monster spawns or TP storms is a reasonable idea, yes? 3. I do not agree, I get the same 'speed run' feeling while playing PC as I do playing VS in early game, not mid or late game but definitively early game and I am sticking with my view that this is not subjective.

1. In Vintage Story within about 5 hours you are going to have copper weapons, at that point even though monsters spawn on your deed they are not remotely close to a threat, they are more like flies. Before your first 5 hours if a monster spawns in your home its something more important, after you get copper its really not a big deal. Having played most likely 1000 hours and on multiplayer servers as well would you say my description there is fairly accurate or am I way off? How about this idea: A simple craft and you can have a Deed Stake. You can only have one Deed Stake, without purchasing more from a trader. That Deed Stake will give you a 15x15 block 'safe zone'. In that zone storms do not happen and monsters do not spawn and in fact, botorns do not throw spears at you from the outside of that Deed area. If you want to expand your deed you can by a deed expander from any merchant and it is an incremental cost, the larger expansion the more it costs. Now here is what might be the best part. You can choose NOT to have a deed at all. Even though I struggle to understand why anyone would want to be interrupted by drifters while planning out a house is beyond me this could be an intresting game play that could work for everyone. let me guess...no way 2. Why do I bring up Planet Crafter or KSP: because, like I have said, in PC and KSP you still have the thrill of the task, its still a rush, its still a hurry and yet there is no interruptions. I believe rather strongly that the attraction to game play is really the cadence between input to reward and tasks ahead and as long as that cadence is good it really does not matter what is being done, however, interruptions conflicts with that cadence. 3. I have no idea why you like VS more than PC but its NOT because you like drifters spawning in your base or have a great desire for TP storms. That much I am very confident in.

again. its not about randomness, its about 'interruptions'. You finally made it back to the town and you are sorting out your bill at the Inn, sorting your belonging and BAM the DM then magically rolls you out of what you are doing and pushes you into a 1 week adventure in some cave that you were magically transported too while you were trying to pay your bill. thanks for understanding

ok but for the purposes of this conversation lets all try (myself included) to focus the conversation on 'interruptions' and not just 'RNG'. The reason I say that is because the difference in general context would be unimportant however in this conversation its critical and its very easy to accidently get it off rails (and I am speaking to me as much as anyone else). On that note, I do not think you prefer Vintage Story over Planet Crafters because of the 'interruptions' it provides which realistically only affects the first 5 hours of game play, outside of wolves to be fair. I also think its extremely disingenuous for others to suggest 'well castiron I think this kind of game is not for you' when what I am talking about makes up most likely less than 5% of the game play and to be completely frank the VAST majority of players do not come here because they are hyper compelled to play 'interruption' simulator that this specific game would provide which again only happens in the first 5 hours of game play. They come here to explore and build. Also as a point of reflection, I am a big fan of cave diving as it is, I see that as 'planned randomness' I find monsters spawning in your area to be distracting, unpleasant and pointless in a way that should not even have a possible alteration to make it have a point and most importantly I would love to fully understand why someone would like that specific game play as it is and as it could be (again 'interruption' not just rng). Why do they insist that having monsters spawn on what would be a person 'deed' is critical game play that should never be changed. I see suggestions for all kinds of changes in general but that one specific change just seems to be universally rejected, despite the fact that is it likely the most bland part of the entire game.

1. that actually makes total sense to me. I would not be able to explain it coherently but it makes sense to me. 2. I cant speak to that. 3. I am not sure mechanical power changes actually affect existing mechanical power, it adds options does it not? maybe I need to look into this. That all said, I am rather excited about this update, this update are the kind of features I personally want, less so story content.

I do not know the context of what you guys are talking about but for the record I want to make clear my thesis is about interruption, not about random. I have made the mistake of using those two words interchangeably but my intent is to focus on interruption. For example, find a ruin, how much boney soil is there would be random. Digging and then all of the sudden out of nowhere a bear attacks you, that would be defined as interruption. I understand that technically both are random but I want (for the purposes of this conversation) to focus on the type of RNG that causes rather large interruptions to your existing play loop in that moment.

I did in my main post. If asked I would just end up re-typing it. If there is any of that example in my main post appears to not be talking about interuptions let me know and I will try to clarify

It took me awhile to understand you are referring to The Planet Crafter. It has been my mistake to use the word 'random' in my examples. I am really focused on Interruptions. My bad for not being clear.

I agree and to say again, I am not against RNG I understand its importance in games. I am saying interruption. Interruption is my entire thesis here, not RNG. Which is more compelling? going to the RA to encounter mystery and RNG or having RNG interrupt your building plans? THAT is my point EDIT: Regardling TP and drifters I am asking you if they are a major pillar to your game play experience because of the interuption factor. Not by extension of several layers deep but rather a major pillar to your game play experience where if they did NOT spawn in your base you would be disapointed near to the point of not playing the game, hopefully you can understand why I build that context given our conversation of Planet Crafter vs Vintage story. Because in that context the conversation was implicitly 'why we play the game at all'. I am suggesting you do not play it becuase or near because drifters can spawn in your base (CORRECTION: It has been my mistake to use the word 'random' in my examples. I am really focused on Interruptions. My bad for not being clear.)

once I stepped back a bit and gave all of this more thought I have to say I do believe that you feel 'interruption' game experience is important game play to you. HOWEVER, not in this specific game. There is just not enough 'interruption' game play experience in this specific game to make that a major motivator for play. TP storms? vast majority of people just sleep thru it, likely even you. drifters spawning in base? after copper you like just find it a bother like the rest of us. So the VAST majority of your game play you are doing something else and those things are more than likely the real motivator and attraction for you on this game. So for example: I find it a really hard sell to imply 'Planet crafters is just to predictable to for me but VS has plenty of randomness (correction: interuptions) to keep me engaged'. I can find that true for the first 5 hours of game play but after that I find that hard to believe to be honest.

no actually I am saying something different in that specific comment. What I am saying in that specific comment is that I am sure people can argue that 'interruption' RNG is engaging as a general principle. However, by proxy to imply that such 'interruption' RNG in this SPECIFIC game is somehow a pillar to the experience is actually absurd. Why do I say 'absurd'? Because in this specific game the vast majority of us (likely including everyone replying) does not even engage in TP storms and after copper find drifters spawning in base to be nothing more than a nuisance which means, they are actually playing this game for a different reason than the ones they are purporting here in this thread. make sense? To borrow from Thorfinn as an example: (not direct quote just lightly borrowed). Planet Crafters does not have enough interruptions to keep me engaged but Vintage Story does. Let that sink in a bit. Does that really sound plausible if you break it down honestly?

I think that is kinda what I am saying. I forget an important dimension to this proposition I am giving. Any counter view on what I am suggesting would almost require to come from a position that the current RNG interruptions and its storms are actually one of its best features..but is it? More I think about it the more I see the argument I am making is that going to the resonance archives for adventure is a better game design that adventure randomly coming to you even if you are trying to go to the bathroom (so to speak)

I would say the following games have just as much engagement, adrenaline pumping excitement with no interruptions Stationeers, Planet Crafters and even Kerbal Space Program while in flight, maybe not because of the possiblity of death but because you are presented with a challenge that as a good cadence feedback loop. Which is my point, I believe that it is possible to create the same positive experience without interruptions and thus reduce the negative, ADHD inducing side effects. ADDED: oh and as a side note, are we really making the suggestion that the randomness of drifters and TP storms in this game is really what makes it awesome sauce? I mean lets step back a bit maybe

I am reading your reply and struggling a bit to put it all together could you do me a favor and maybe number all of this so i can put it together as it relates to what you are replying to I am not the best at reading comprehension or conveying concepts to others to be fair. My underling point is, dont you think you can have the same level of engagement and excitement WITHOUT having interuptions on your path

sorry I asked this question and I should not have, it was my fault for bringing it up. Lets please get back on the core topic of 'interruption', I do not want to discuss what is or is not survial game here in this thread. Again, my fault. thanks for understanding

how would a modded minecraft be different from a survial standpoint than just playing vintage story with hostile set to passive?

1. I want to make this extremely clear, I am not suggesting "mistaking engagement with satisfaction" is a defect. I do it all the time myself. 2. have you played Planet Crafters by chance? 3. If you can, can you explain why you think interruptions specifically is a requirement for your desired game play as you have described and why it could not be manifested in a different way. So for example, a world can push back on your progress without interruptions. Interruptions are really only real time RNG within an RNG moment. Does that make sense? So for example, lets say you needed to do X in order to progress and that X had a TON of randomness to it and is highly unpredictable. What if that moment of randomness was a place you go to instead of a place that comes to you randomly. aka NOT RNG within RNG if that makes sense? can you elaborate because i am honestly curious. Basically what I am saying is this: isnt Resonance Archive challenges better than randomly interrupting your work at base? ADDED: I think its also helpful to distinguish that RNG and 'Interruption RNG' are two very different things within the context of my 'thesis'

agreed, which is kind of my point. Its the problem solving exercise that is enjoyable. So for example Planet Crafters, all the same amount of engagement, same amount of problem solving, etc. all have the same emotions of trying to solve a issue BUT..none of this 'interruption' stuff. make sense?

what specific crafting/building/block game with tons of things to make and build would you suggest then? Lets me honest here though, if you play a VS playthrough until end game, 90% of that game play when it comes to monsters is not exactly much of a challenge is it? its more like dealing with an ant problem in the kitchen or sometimes stopping what you are doing to sleep thru a storm, so clearly for people who play this game alot there is something else that they are compelled to. Lets be level here.

I am glad you read my detailed explanation as to why that is. Its fairly clear once you step back and read those points I wrote. The evidence is fairly obvious in those details I gave (Part 1 was very obvious in fact). I think maybe you just were not fully thinking thru what you were saying, I hope my reflection on your words helps. I would imagine looking back on it now that the argument of 'we can change how temporal storms work but we can not make them not global because the developers want it that way' is a bit circular and contradictory, we all do it sometimes.