Temperature Resistances and Adding Heatstroke / Heat Exhaustion

[jeremy13621362]

Your character shouldn't be only able to take damage from the cold. It would make more sense that you would have to stay cool as well as stay warm. I do not like the idea of wearing just a fur coat and full fur clothes and being impervious to all weather. 

[idiomcritter]

how cool am I?

fully dec'd out in my fur clothing, and snow goggles during the mid day sun thru the dog dazes of summer!  

uh huh thats right, i'm chill

[Maelstrom]

With freezing, there's a remedy.  What would the remedy be for overheating because adding this mechanic has downstream implications that have to be coded.  One such mechanic is a thirst bar in addition to the hunger bar which has been mentioned multiple times in the past year alone.

[Thorfinn]

Right. Would it really add anything if you had to go caving or sit under a tree or go for a quick swim in the heat of the day if you set up base somewhere warmer? Would you get penalized for smithing in the summer? Particularly if you had an enclosed smithy with nowhere for the heat (or smoke) to go? Would that be a selling point if you were describing the game to a friend?

Personally, I'm just not seeing the attraction.

[jeremy13621362]

Maybe having a camelpack or some form of water that you can bring with you. Having clothes that cover your head like bandanas. A thirst bar would be really easy to code from my perspective. A thirst bar would be just a small blue bar over the hunger bar that slowly depletes over time. Make it so that its a world multiplier that you can scale. Have it be affected by the ambient temperature by adding a multiplier to it. Your hunger goes down faster if you're hurt so why is different from that of your thirst going down faster when you run?

 

[Thorfinn]

I get that it might be fairly easy to add another bar. My hesitancy is that I don't see how it adds fun to the game. Until you have whatever it takes to make a wineskin or camelback (and maybe even then), you need to use up a precious inventory slot to carry a gourd or crock or something with water in it.

Why not a scurvy bar if you don't eat enough fruit, or a beri-beri bar if you don't eat enough grain? Or a parasitic infection like giardia if you got the water from a stagnant pond?

Edited April 24 by Thorfinn

[jeremy13621362]

Those sound like fine ideas. You already get "debuffs" from not eating enough of these food groups by way of less health. Water, on the other hand, is a basic necessity where you could have it be a setting in the world generation. There is already a setting for hunger rate so why not thirst rate? Just keep it simple, you do not necessarily need to have a camel pack but you could bring a jug with you instead.

[Maelstrom]

Well, if we're going to make things more realistic, let's start with carrying capacity.  Currently a seraph can carry over 1,920 cubic meters of dirt, sand, rock, etc. basically making them a walking freight train.  Shouldn't we limit the ability to carry that high fertility soil to just 1 cubic meter for consideration of bulk and weight being realistic?

[Thorfinn]

With a specific gravity of roughly 2.7, a single cubic meter of soil would be somewhere around 2,7 metric tons. A single log would be a bit under a ton. That's a pretty butch seraph.

That doesn't necessarily mean thirst is a bad idea. Just that it needs something more than "realistic" to make it fun. 

[ArtiKs]

3 hours ago, Maelstrom said:

Well, if we're going to make things more realistic, let's start with carrying capacity.  Currently a seraph can carry over 1,920 cubic meters of dirt, sand, rock, etc. basically making them a walking freight train.  Shouldn't we limit the ability to carry that high fertility soil to just 1 cubic meter for consideration of bulk and weight being realistic?

Adding hot and cold drinks to resist for longer the harsh environments that get worse due to the seasons, also means less inventory space when exploring… which makes me wonder if there will ever be anything after leather backpacks. I´ve never made steel at all as it seems pointless, but I swear I could delve into the steelmaking process if it means that more valuable inventory slots are the reward.

[ArtiKs]

@Maelstrom "What would the remedy be for overheating because adding this mechanic has downstream implications that must be coded?"  
Technically speaking freezing is a bar; It’s just not visible until the temperature drops to display visual cues. I think that there are even mods that make it visible. The remedy could be as simple as wearing the appropriate clothes. We have winter ones, so how about loose-fitting, lightweight clothes made of breathable materials, such as cotton or linen? If you ask me, I think those could fit the aesthetic of the game. There are some unobtainable sets that could be tweaked and useful, like the survivor set or the peasant set.

"One such mechanic is a thirst bar in addition to the hunger bar which has been mentioned multiple times in the past year alone."
After a lot of thought, I ended up agreeing with you both, Maelstrom and Thorfinn… though I would say that if poultices are to health-bars what foods are to hunger-bars, what would drinks even be needed for besides roleplay? 
I’ve come to the realization that most food is at room temperature or below when it rests in a cellar. The whole objective revolving food is preservation, but beverages are absorbed faster (just take a sip of any cider in-game and you’ll see…), the player could get short effects related to stuff that food alone can’t reach like temperature adjustments, so a thirst bar isn’t needed at all. It’s just "food" that targets different stats in the default “C” display.

[ArtiKs]

@Thorfinn Would it really add anything if you had to go caving or sit under a tree or going for a quick swim in the heat of the day if you set up base somewhere warmer?
I think that since the game took some inspiration from Don’t Starve Together, people expect the seasons other than winter to have something unique like they are in that game. Caving, switching clothes, head gear and diving are literally the same as wearing fur clothes and setting up campfires every now and again when freezing. I’d argue this gives tailors a purpose beyond aesthetic and roleplay.

Would you get penalized for smithing in the summer?
Freezing and hunger kill the player so slowly that you have time to perform several actions. The penalty is also specific as it would only happen during summer afternoons when the heat is at its peak or maybe during sandstorms if you live in a desert. If smithing sessions are kept short, overheating should not be an issue. Just like the cold is a threat, the heat should be one too, but only when extremes are met. Irl blacksmithing is a seasonal job, but this is a game where the player needs to manipulate metals often. Cold drinks plus certain clothes should help isolate the seraph from the heat, like wearing the blacksmith apron and maybe gloves as leveled-up thongs. Maybe there is no immediate “penalty” if the smithing place isn’t recognized as a room and counts as an open space with a roof? Idk.

Particularly if you had an enclosed smithy with nowhere for the heat (or smoke) to go? Personally, I'm just not seeing the attraction.
Smoke and asphyxia are a totally different rabbit hole… and beyond smithing, it would affect mining the most. If the game gets to that level of realism I would not see the attraction either.

[Maelstrom]

13 hours ago, ArtiKs said:

The remedy could be as simple as wearing the appropriate clothes. We have winter ones, so how about loose-fitting, lightweight clothes made of breathable materials, such as cotton or linen?

Those warm weather clothes already exist in the form of the clothes on your back after choosing a class.

[Thorfinn]

@ArtiKs I agree completely that thirst and heat exhaustion and all similar effects are similar to other game aspects, and even that they could be relatively easy to implement. I just have yet to hear anyone complete the sentence, "This would  make the game more fun because..."

Would the game be more fun with a Stardew Valley Stamina bar, or My Time at Portia Sprint bar? Maybe, but I'd rather hear the argument for them rather than simply, "Other games have them" or "It would be easy to implement" or "Its more realistic." Butchering is abstracted to a completely unrealistic, absurd level. Realistically it should take hours, and should generate more than 1 leg bone. But I'm not convinced that would make it more fun. Berries only produce a couple weeks per year, blackberries a week or so later than raspberries around here, but would that make the game more enjoyable?

When you look at the complaints and rage quits, very rarely is it because the game is too easy.

Edited April 25 by Thorfinn