Tabulius

Do you have any reference of devs saying this?

Haven't played the update yet, but curious what people who have think about the spear change. I was excited when I saw the addition of iron spears, then rolled my eyes when I saw it said that they all got nerfed. Is this basically a glorified global nerfing of spears where now the new iron spears are hardly better than the old bronze? Or is this a reasonable balance change? Anyone able to compare the old stats with the new?

Which mod?

I personally don't think it ever happened to me, it clearly got worse in later updates. Regardless if spawning was prevented inside of houses I can't see anyone honestly complaining about that compromise.

I still haven't seen anyone provide a reason as to how simply reverting the storms back to pre-1.21 where enemies wouldn't spawn in your house is bad or has any downsides. I still think it's not where storms should ultimately go because regardless I find storms to be pretty boring and a barebones implementation of a cool idea. But at least as a placeholder I can't see how anyone would be more upset with this then the current state of things.

I never said they should be removed. I don't think anyone said they should be removed, you can agree a mechanic has merit whilst also criticizing it's implementation. Just because the game is marketed as having cosmic horror elements doesn't force it to design it's mechanics in this way. I beg to differ, temporal storms as they currently are represent a refusal to compromise. What we had before was a compromise, before players who didn't want to engage didn't have to, and players who did could. Now, there is only one glaringly obvious option, and that is to fight, or, do nothing. I'll also say that players who genuinely enjoy the combat as it currently is seem to be a minority considering how lackluster it is. The only person I've seen say they genuinely enjoy it and don't just tolerate it is LadyWYT. Also, if you know any mods that address this please let me know, because I've searched many a time and haven't found any. The closest I've found was temporal tempest and it's abandoned.

Ya this is something I see a lot and it gets annoying. People using the lore as a defense for gameplay mechanics. Could possibly be that the storm takes place in whatever biome you're in at the moment, but if you leave you're safe. I don't see how that would contradict the lore. You must be luckier than me because I most often build small bases and they always spawn inside.

This is not an excuse for bad design. In past updates players were confined to the safety of their homes if they didn't want to interact with the storms, there's nothing wrong with that. The current iteration basically gives you nothing to do but tab out and wait for a minimum 5 minutes. If you think that's a reasonable gameplay alternative I don't know what to tell you other than you must have more patience for your time being wasted then you ought to. How? I used to do all these before enemies were able to spawn indoors. Now if I risk doing these I chance enemies spawning and getting into a fight in the tight corridors of my house. This is an option we have only been further disincentivized from doing, intentionally so might I add.

I've mentioned this before in an earlier thread, but I think this deserves it's own. I think temporal storms are in concept and in lore a very fun idea, other games have mechanics some what similar and they work to great effect. See stalkers emissions, dangerous storms you have to seek shelter from or be obliterated, and then after the fact you risk running into zombified enemies. The difference is where emissions in stalker are an occasional moment of tension that adds a nice dynamic element and immersion to the game, the temporal storms are a day wasting annoyance that in the early game serve to do nothing more than interrupt your game. Emmisions are brief, lasting around a minute, and all they essentially do is force you to drop what you're doing and run for cover. Temporal storms force you to plan your day around them, as they last 5 - 10 minutes, This is only made more annoying with there increasing frequency and length as a playthrough continues. The other annoying part is that my choice as a player is extremely hampered during storms. It used to be that I could choose to wait them out, but we've been increasingly railroaded into having to fight. Now your options are either, fight (or farm), run the whole time, wait in a 1 by 1 bunker/trader caravan, or enable sleeping during storms. The last 3 are not enjoyable options for anyone and essentially equate to a refusal to engage with the mechanic as has been railroaded. Some may say that I should just turn them off. I've been tempted, but ultimately they're too useful for farming gears once you get the proper set up. I also still really like the idea, I just resent being forced into it every time when I may have had other plans for that day. I don't like having to enable sleeping through them as it completely removes the fun immersive aspect there used to be of being safe in your house while enemies were outside, but at this point it's the only good compromise left. As a whole I think we should at the very least have more options for configuring how the storm works, or they should be reworked. Does anyone actually like storms as they are now? I've seen people talk about how they like it mostly for the lore and atmosphere, but the actual mechanic? The novelty wears off quickly and they're too gamey and simply implemented to exhibit the horror they were intended to at least for me. I never get scared or immersed whenever a storm happens. Instead I get annoyed and immediately taken out of the game because I start wondering how such a poorly designed feature hasn't been adjusted yet.

No way dude! That's sick, I'll be adding it to my future servers and I'll let you know if there's problems. Thanks for putting in the effort where I've been slacking off

I'm actually gonna have to amend that opinion again. I had been playing with CO for a while and it's changes were subtle enough that I didn't realize how much of a difference it made. Going back to vanilla there are a lot of little things that are different. For one hit reg is definitely worse in vanilla. There were multiples times where my reticle was red and I 100% should have landed a hit but it didn't register, that never happened with CO. There were also times where my reticle wouldn't go red even though I should be in range. Another thing is enemy attacks are better telegraphed and easier to dodge. In vanilla some of the enemies will still hit you even if you're far enough away that you logically should have dodged them. This is probably where most of the complaints about wolves come from. Also enemies like shivers and bears which are slightly faster than the player in vanilla, also have a quick difficult to dodge attack, with a hitbox larger than the actual animation. Where as in CO I'd say they may have over corrected a little. Now you can basically avoid all damage just by walking (not running) backwards and side stepping when they attack. Bears are also slowed, to the point where they are slightly slower than the player at sprint, instead of slightly faster like in vanilla. Also, armor is so much worse in vanilla. Walk speed being halved with plate is ridiculous, and makes you a sitting duck. You can't even chase down bowtorns, since they're slightly faster than you. So if you get caught out in the open with full plate during a storm with a bunch of bowtorns around you your only option is to retreat. Compared to that even with 3 layers of plate, chain, and gambeson your speed is only reduced to 71% in CO meaning you're still able to actually respond to the enemy. I think CO is definitely a more balanced experience, I rarely feel like a death wasn't my fault when using CO. However it arguably trivializes some of the enemies too much. Fast enemies like wolves are a lot more fair, but their attacks are almost stationary now. You could avoid all damage by standing still and then stepping back at the first telegraph. Rarely do they do the jumping attack that's the bane of many a noob, and even when they do it's way easier to avoid. And some attacks you almost have to be inside of the enemy to get hit. Where as in vanilla, the only viable strategy is to kite them. If you try to side step an attack at all the risk is way too high and you'll almost certainly take the hit. I do think CO is preferable to vanillas feeling of it being a wild card whether you dodge an attack or not, and it's not like it makes enemies unchallenging, but especially one on one enemies are not the same threat they were. I think it would be nice if the standard strategy of kiting enemies to death was broken up. In both vanilla and CO enemies will track you perfectly if you side step or jump around them. So your main means of fighting is always kiting. This is pretty universally considered to be a sign of poor design. CO avoids this better because of how much more forgiving the hit boxes are, but especially with multiple enemies you'll be kiting a lot. I think the longer reach of vanilla enemy attacks wouldn't be as much of a problem if they couldn't track you perfectly and seemingly change direction during attacks.

I had this idea in another thread but I would like to mention it here because I really think something like this could solve the issue of food perishing when you're logged off on multiplayer. Here's how it would work. Whenever you place a storage object a system would tag it as yours. Whenever you log off, item aging would pause on all storage objects tagged as yours until someone else uses them or you log back on. If someone other than you uses one of your storage units while you're offline that player gets a temporary tag that lasts as long as their session. And the storage unit they used becomes unpaused until that player also logs off. And of course, if someone breaks the object it loses its tag and if they place it down it will be tagged as theirs. This method doesn't seem to be easily exploitable, though you will possibly also have to account for hoppers in some way. It doesn't seem that complicated to me but i'm ignorant to how difficult coding something like this in would be. If anyones interested in the idea or shedding light on it's feasibility it'd be appreciated. I might look into making it myself if it's not all that difficult

Referring to CO. For some reason bears are damage tier 0 in CO, they are literally completely incapable of damaging you if you have any kind of armor that gives full coverage. Unless I have another mod effecting it but I can't think of what would.

Having played more with combat overhaul I don't think it's a solution, and it also has it's own share of problems. It makes combat more complex mainly with area specific damage, but it doesn't really improve the existing flaws. A lot of the complaints about combat in general are hit box related. And although hitboxes do seem to be a problem I think in a lot of cases the problem isn't actually enemy hit boxes but the way hits are registered. You have to have your reticle on the enemy while the weapon is swinging or else it won't hit. This means that tiny enemies like locusts are an utter pain to fight, because you have no AOE attacks and you need to be pin point accurate. Faster enemies like shivers can be easy to miss, and hordes of enemies in general are difficult because even if you can swing wide enough that your weapon should hit multiple, it only registers what your reticle covers. CO does improve this a bit, I'm not sure if it was added in the mod or it exists in the vanilla game but I have been been able to damage multiple enemies if they're clustered, particularly with pole arms. But it's not something I can reliably count on since the mod still relies on the pin point reticle based hit reg. On top of that, it makes some really odd changes to armor. Like making brigandine completely useless since it has all the same debuffs as plate but worse stats. In general early game armor is trash, that's also true for vanilla, but in vanilla there would be some benefit to even copper lamellar even if it wasn't really worth making for most people. Now lamellar in general is completely useless outside of surface armor, and even as surface armor it's not good because it can't be layered with anything else, you'd be better of just using chain mail and layering with gambeson. Scale kind of has a use since you can wear gambeson with it, but it's still just marginally better than just wearing chain and gambeson. It would be better to not waste the metal since you'll still have a use for chain, but you'll out grow scale. Side note, I've also discovered that any amount of armor will make you completely impervious to bears, even a single layer of basic gambeson. This is definitely a glitch. I do really like the new weapons. and the region based damage in theory. But I think changing hit reg is needed first. Weapons and their attacks having physicalized hitboxes instead of just being a thing you hold to increase your damage would make a bigger difference than most of what CO changes.

Really? I didn't know they changed that, that's good. Can you take from cooking pots too? Still would be nice to be able to cut up pies in your inventory but precutting pies isn't as much of a problem.

Don't think I got a log since the game didn't hard crash it just froze up completely. I think it's probably mods but I'm not sure if it's better ruins, I've had it installed for a while. I've had these problems before so better ruins might be at least a compounding factor, but they started to ramp up recently. I have 32 gigs and the game got to the point where it was using over half of that. It was doable, I could drink from the reservoir and the mines, but it wasn't fun. Plus the mod makes it impossible to stock up on water beforehand because it makes you super slow if you're carrying water. I had to rush through the library cause I had ran out of water. Food in general should really be reworked in the story content. You're basically restricted to using cut up pies or bread, anything else with decent satiety requires you to place it on the ground. It'd be nice if you could cut up food or take from a crock in your inventory.

Trying to beat chapter 1 while the game is leaking memory. I had like 5 second intervals of time to fight between freezes. I died literally 1 hit away from killing the boss, not because of the boss, but starvation. The game kept freezing so much I didn't notice. Then when I came back and beat the boss the memory leak finally occupied my last megabyte of ram and the game crashed. Wasn't funny to me, but it's funny now thinking about it. Also, playing the story content with hydrate or diedrate installed is a bad idea, that mod is not balanced for dungeon crawling.

This thread kind of turned into a thread complaining about complaining about combat This is what I made the thread to address, VS seems to be setting itself up to do the same thing. With combat as it is there's no problem with it being just another gameplay loop. But the issue is that it comprises the majority of what you're supposed to be working towards in the late game and doing in the endgame. And then there's temporal storms which I'm not sure if any one is happy with in their current state.

I haven't had a chance to try the temporal tempest mod, but it seems like it would fix some of the issues I have with temporal storms. Enemies not spawning randomly in and around your house but instead from rifts, allowing you to prep defense. That encourages you to fight them in order to shorten the storm while still having the option to wait the storm out in your base.

A possibility might be a system that automatically tags storage units placed by a player as theirs. Then everything spoils and ages based on if they're online or not. When they're offline if another player uses it, it restarts the aging process until they log off as well. But unlike the main player using it, it doesn't restart when they log back on unless they interact with that object again. In theory this could kind of be gamed by players who don't own the storage logging off and on right after using it. But that's enough of a pain that i'd guess most people wouldn't bother.

Disagree, the problem with combat isn't that it's mediocre. it's that, combined with the fact that it's an ever present aspect of the game that only seems to be getting more important. If one of the main gameplay loops isn't enjoyable then there's a problem. And one that's more significant than adding new features. Most people on both sides of the argument seem to agree that combat isn't fun. Those on the anti-overhaul side's opposition often isn't that they think combat is ideal, but just that they're afraid that an overhaul will put more focus on combat. That seems like a somewhat mute point to me, as combat is already at the core of the game, and the main part of the story. So, if we're gonna do it we should do it right. Something like this becomes a lot harder to adjust as development continues. Personally I don't think CO fully addresses the issues with combat, certainly not the ones that seem to be most complained about. It more so rebalances it and improves a few things. The combat still feels like it's lacking identity, and isn't satisfying to engage with. I think that has more to do with the enemies, their feed back, ai, and player movement. Where as CO focuses on weapons and armor. I do like it better, but fights still feel like a chore most of the time. I agree with @Forks take, that a lot of this comes down to how the combat feels more than anything. I've played games with way less robust combat mechanics that were more exciting to have fights in, the forest comes to mind.

I tried something like this once, but I couldn't harvest near enough flax to make sails in a reasonable amount of time. The later half of my play through would have been just waiting for flax to grow for at least a year.

Even up to the American revolutionary war people were still arguing the merits of archery in a military context. So I think bows shouldn't be outmoded by early matchlocks.

I'm in amused disbelief that you made a novels worth of boomer memes for a forum thread

I think you two are using different definitions of easy. You seem to mean it as what takes less exertion, which you would be correct it does take less exertion. Where as mayushii seems to mean it as takes less skill. Which as far as I can see is also right. It doesn't really take any more skill in vanilla. There isn't anything you can do to better narrow ore down aside from taking readings and knowing your biome. So the only real difference is how much trial and error you have to do after.