Why don't devs add iron spears?

[Rainer]

Sorry if this has been talked about before but I looked it up and couldn't find anything.

Bows are nice but I thoroughly enjoy using spears. I'm well into the iron and it's always bothered me how I can't make one of of iron. I'm sure that there's some balancing reason for this because of the damage stacking for higher tier metals, but if that's the case then I'm not sure why there couldn't just have a max damage for all spears if that would be a problem.

Is there some other reason why we can't have iron spears?

[Thorfinn]

Because spears are already way overpowered. What would you make them? 9 damage? 10? To the falx's 5?

[LadyWYT]

I would presume it's for balancing reasons as well, since spears have significant ranged damage(to be fair, you need to actually hit the target though, and it's not always wise to go throwing away your primary weapons) as well as the most reach of any melee weapon. If you allow spear types past the bronze tier, then you start running into the issue of the other weapons being much less attractive, because they can't really compete with the potential damage output.

[Malanox]

They should just balance the output for lower tier spears. Doesn't make any sense for them to just "not have iron spears" because they would be OP. I prefer spear and then finally progressing to iron just to find out I cannot upgrade my primary weapon is a massive disappointment

[Rhyagelle]

I agree.

I think it is extremely silly to not have iron spears just because it could be OP. Why not, then, keep the overall stats for the last tier spear available but adjust the health of the weapon to iron? Spear is my favorite weapon and it's just so bizarre that I can't make a spear out of iron...

[Tom Cantine]

16 minutes ago, Rhyagelle said:

I agree.

I think it is extremely silly to not have iron spears just because it could be OP. Why not, then, keep the overall stats for the last tier spear available but adjust the health of the weapon to iron? Spear is my favorite weapon and it's just so bizarre that I can't make a spear out of iron...

Musashi Miyamoto wrote that it is not good to have a favourite weapon, because you should be prepared to fight with whatever is at hand.

But yeah, spears rule. There's a reason they remained the dominant infantry weapon well past the invention of gunpowder.

And I agree that iron or steel spears would make sense, even if they don't do any extra damage. But maybe it's that iron is so plentiful that spears just become too cheap, once you progress to that point? Still, I find that kind of metagame balance rationale unsatisfying.

[Rainer]

On 6/10/2025 at 7:15 PM, Tom Cantine said:

Musashi Miyamoto wrote that it is not good to have a favourite weapon, because you should be prepared to fight with whatever is at hand.

But yeah, spears rule. There's a reason they remained the dominant infantry weapon well past the invention of gunpowder.

And I agree that iron or steel spears would make sense, even if they don't do any extra damage. But maybe it's that iron is so plentiful that spears just become too cheap, once you progress to that point? Still, I find that kind of metagame balance rationale unsatisfying.

A falx costs the same amount of metal as a spear, so cost wouldn't be an issue

[MattyK]

It was mentioned in another thread that Spears are currently one of the best weapons in the game, hence why they're limited to the Bronze Age. Rebalancing the low-end of Spears to make up for adding an Iron equivalent would completely invalidate their usefulness as early-game hunting tools, making them so ineffective that you'd never want to use a Flint Spear in the first place.

In the same vein, it's very much in the spirit of the game that they want you to advance through the ages to more sophisticated hunting tools, going from spears (hunting), to bows (a more sophisticated way of hunting), to eventually making traps (at which point hunting just becomes passive). 

As a weapon though, I believe they want you to have more options later. Ancient Armory shows this by implementing the unutilized assets in Vintage Story's assets (albeit with primitive animations), so it's clear that later on, polearms will be the go-to for your long-armed needs.

Edited June 12, 2025 by MattyK

[Tom Cantine]

9 hours ago, Rainer said:

A falx costs the same amount of metal as a spear, so cost wouldn't be an issue

Except that spears are also used as missile weapons, and carrying several for that purpose is pretty common. The trade off is that (1) flint spears are fairly cheap but don't do huge damage, and (2) bronze spears which do more damage are constrained by the scarcity of the metals involved. Iron is so cheap (once you get to that level) that throwable iron spears would almost make people stop asking for guns to be implemented.

[Guimoute]

I already use a recurve bow which means I have 64 times more projectiles stored per slot than if I was using spears, and that thing costs basically nothing (one leather) so I'm not sure where we are going with the scarcity argument. Iron is plentiful once you find it but you trade scarcity of the material for extra work in working the metal instead of just melting and casting. 

[Rainer]

On 6/12/2025 at 5:10 AM, MattyK said:

It was mentioned in another thread that Spears are currently one of the best weapons in the game, hence why they're limited to the Bronze Age. Rebalancing the low-end of Spears to make up for adding an Iron equivalent would completely invalidate their usefulness as early-game hunting tools, making them so ineffective that you'd never want to use a Flint Spear in the first place.

In the same vein, it's very much in the spirit of the game that they want you to advance through the ages to more sophisticated hunting tools, going from spears (hunting), to bows (a more sophisticated way of hunting), to eventually making traps (at which point hunting just becomes passive). 

As a weapon though, I believe they want you to have more options later. Ancient Armory shows this by implementing the unutilized assets in Vintage Story's assets (albeit with primitive animations), so it's clear that later on, polearms will be the go-to for your long-armed needs.

 

23 hours ago, Tom Cantine said:

Except that spears are also used as missile weapons, and carrying several for that purpose is pretty common. The trade off is that (1) flint spears are fairly cheap but don't do huge damage, and (2) bronze spears which do more damage are constrained by the scarcity of the metals involved. Iron is so cheap (once you get to that level) that throwable iron spears would almost make people stop asking for guns to be implemented.

These explanations make a lot of sense honestly. I see why they don't implement it but it's a shame I can't match my armor with my spears lal

[Zane Mordien]

I still want the durability increase.

[GrandChercheur]

On 3/19/2025 at 9:38 PM, LadyWYT said:

I would presume it's for balancing reasons as well, since spears have significant ranged damage(to be fair, you need to actually hit the target though, and it's not always wise to go throwing away your primary weapons) as well as the most reach of any melee weapon. If you allow spear types past the bronze tier, then you start running into the issue of the other weapons being much less attractive, because they can't really compete with the potential damage output.

Even tho it would make thé most sence. Spear were THE primary weapon of a lot of army. 

[WalrusJones]

Honestly one thing you could do is have the damage tiers of falxes scale faster than spears, that way the game lore is preserved. Falxes are for being can openers while spears are for anti-soft target duties (With the straight swords doubling down on this role of being anti-soft target.)

The Falx exists and has value because it beats the metallic interiors of monsters, the spear exists because it does magnitudes better damage against wild animals.
The various unique straightswords could have the arguable honor of having great durability for beating trash mobs.

Other similar games have used verbs like blunt/piercing/chopping to give weapons conditional modifiers against monsters which could be useful for establishing enemies which are not best countered by simply killing them from outside their reach (Since they aren't hurt by a linear hole punching action much.)
Say if falxes did sheering damage due to their can opener like design which was the verb of choice that is most affective against unnatural abominations (While having a mix of the chopping/piercing benefits otherwise.)

Could also be used to benefit the armor system since then you could try to match armor to counter certain threats you run into (IE: Mail being barely more useful than a jerkin against blunt, moderately useful against pierce, great against chopping/sawing/biting. Padded brigandine being very weight efficient versus blunt due to being a good force spreader, but it has less to write home about against piercing as there are more gaps for projectiles to fine.)
Not all armor would have to do this, with stuff like lamellar (Introductory level), and plate (Endgame) being an easy targets for not having any verbage modifiers.
But you can see how this would benefit a wide range of mid-tier mid weight armors to be able to equip them to tailor your protection against certain threats instead of them all sort of filling the same nebulous space of manufacturing difficulty versus weight tradeoffs, since you have decisions based on what threats you actually are fearing in your next encounter and have a viable reason to collect them all.

Edited July 15, 2025 by WalrusJones

[F4KingSlayer]

it sure would make sense on the realistic aspect but i would id see the spears being made in a type of wood a bit harder to acquire to make it harder to get a good weapon 

or even limit them to unique items like an item you get in a vessel only 

 

[Pervy]

After reading this thread i can understand WHY spears are limited.
Its true the spear is cheap, and easy to make irl. 

Its true... If they added iron/steel spears, there would be no reason to get a different weapon.
I can even understand why making them more durable, would become a problem.

Atleast there are mods for this, and mods are easy to install and all, no need to get skydaz 

[Echo Weaver]

On 6/10/2025 at 9:15 PM, Tom Cantine said:

Musashi Miyamoto wrote that it is not good to have a favourite weapon, because you should be prepared to fight with whatever is at hand.

But yeah, spears rule. There's a reason they remained the dominant infantry weapon well past the invention of gunpowder.

And I agree that iron or steel spears would make sense, even if they don't do any extra damage. But maybe it's that iron is so plentiful that spears just become too cheap, once you progress to that point? Still, I find that kind of metagame balance rationale unsatisfying.

I want spears because my strike has a longer distance than the falx. I don't throw them. I know they're the preferred ranged weapon for a lot of combat-focused players, but the fact that they don't stack is a pretty big disadvantage compared to bows with stacking arrows for adventuring.

If we capped the damage of the spear and just gave increased durability to higher metals, I think that would be fine. The way to not make them OP isn't to remove them. It's to not make them OP.

[LadyWYT]

14 minutes ago, Echo Weaver said:

I want spears because my strike has a longer distance than the falx. I don't throw them. I know they're the preferred ranged weapon for a lot of combat-focused players, but the fact that they don't stack is a pretty big disadvantage compared to bows with stacking arrows for adventuring.

If we capped the damage of the spear and just gave increased durability to higher metals, I think that would be fine. The way to not make them OP isn't to remove them. It's to not make them OP.

Or I mean...just make iron/steel tier spears into pikes instead. They can't be thrown, so they're no longer competing with bows for the ranged slot. They offer much better melee range than the falx or similar melee weapons, however, you could balance that by giving them a minimum effective range too. That way, if an enemy manages to get too close, the spear is no longer effective; swords and other short-range melee weapons are still useful as a sidearm, or in tight spaces like caves where a pike's minimum range is going to be a setback.

[Echo Weaver]

3 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

Or I mean...just make iron/steel tier spears into pikes instead. They can't be thrown, so they're no longer competing with bows for the ranged slot. They offer much better melee range than the falx or similar melee weapons, however, you could balance that by giving them a minimum effective range too. That way, if an enemy manages to get too close, the spear is no longer effective; swords and other short-range melee weapons are still useful as a sidearm, or in tight spaces like caves where a pike's minimum range is going to be a setback.

Is this a proposed weapon or one that exists in the game?

[LadyWYT]

3 hours ago, Echo Weaver said:

Is this a proposed weapon or one that exists in the game?

Just an idea I threw out there  Doesn't actually exist in the game without mods.

[WalrusJones]

I'd love if falx's had something meaningful on right click to distinguish them from spears since left click gaming is the biggest turn off for a weapon for me when its strictly single function.

[Lollard]

An iron tier is obviously missing, they should add a non-throwable polearm for iron if they think that makes it overpowered.

[Thorfinn]

Ok, but what really gets me frosted is there's no phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range. Bullpup, preferably.

[Vlana]

I agree with pretty much everything that has been said here. An i really want a iron long reach weapon.
 

I recently looted from ruins an aged voulge and what seems to be an aged hallberd I think ? I think that should be the solution here.

An Iron version of the spear which has better durability, the reach of the lance, but not throwable so it's not overpowered.
It would do less damage than other iron short reach weapons.
The throwable version would be reserved for stone, copper or bronze.

It even makes sense for the reality. You would throw a pilum, but not an hallberd or a voulge.

[Lugh Crow-Slave]

On 3/19/2025 at 1:02 PM, Thorfinn said:

Because spears are already way overpowered. What would you make them? 9 damage? 10? To the falx's 5?

Honestly.... I would settle for just more dura and no other increase. 

 

However in the late game spears are one of the few things that force you to not just gather iron and keep other resources viable rather than fully obsolete and i don't think this is a bad dynamic.