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Resin replacement options


BenLi
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Since resin is quite a rare resource to obtain - it may be interesting to have some replacement options.

 

Real world natural glue sources are milk - casein glue, and bones - gelatin glue.

 

All this exists in the game except of the mechanisms of evaporating

Given we may use clay pot, with 5(6)*4=20l of liquid, the evaporating mechanism may be easily implemented. For balance it might need a lot of fuel.

 

So it might be as following:

1) Evaporating some 20l of milk gives 1 glue

2) Grinding 10-20 bones, mixing it with 20l of water, then evaporating gives 1 glue

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Or just make it so player grown spruce trees have a chance to spawn resin node.
Or allow us to use the chisel and hammer combo with a bucket, to tap the tree for resin/create a resin node.

With resin being a finite resource and being a gating material is a recipe for disaster, especially on big servers where new players dont exactly understand not to destory the resin nodes.

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There's a couple of mods (don't know there names) where one allows creating resin nodes with a knife and the other creates a tree tap to gather sap to boil down to resin.  I think the former makes the game much too easy while the latter seems in line with the developers intent for the game.

Edited by Maelstrom
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The game is not for speedruns as far as I understand. It is for leisure, creativity, long run time spending.

Resin as for today is one of the bottlenecks/key resources for the game flow - the designers intentionally make it as such for the gamers to play more: you explore the world, you look for resin, you cannot start mechanisms until you have enough resin etc.

Same as getting to copper age makes you able to have saw->planks->tons of blocks and mechanisms.

Same as resin is the key for steel making via pulverizer.

 

Balance.

 

So it is not about making it easy to get resource. You should not get resin easily. If you want it easy - open creative mode.

It is about making alternatives with the same availability and timing. If previously you had to spend RL 4 hours to acquire enough resin for steel making - with the alternative way you have to spend the same RL 4 hours to get enough glue, when playing niche or rarer situations where you just don't have pines: challenges, servers, special spawns, customized world temperature generations etc. Yet it should be part of vanilla, not mods.

 

BTW - evaporating may be implemented with alcohol equipment set, not just cooking pot. Less code to code. Same evaporating mechanism, different resulting product, still must have an ability to take it from the bucket.

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On 7/7/2022 at 7:02 AM, BenLi said:

"So it is not about making it easy to get resource. You should not get resin easily. If you want it easy - open creative mode."

Its not based around balance at all. I highly doubt the devs want the game to be tedious. 
If i make it to even early bronze to late iron, i shouldnt have to spend 4 RL hours searching for resin to make and be creative with windmills and stuff. I just spend 2 RL days searching for iron or tin.

You absolutely contradict yourself. 
You state the games designed for long play and creativity. No if you wanted that "OpEn CrEaTiVe MoDe"

Unlocking new tools and tiers of metal should result in the past tedium becoming much easier with new technology.
Its really that simple.

The whole "if you want it easy goto creative" right after stating that the basic experience(which is survival) is supposed to for creativity and leisure play is insane.
Dont even get me started on the games tendency to be leaning towards realism, and how unrealistic it is a caveman whos discovered alloying and metal bloomeries to not make the correlation between pine resin leaking from scrapes in trees, and being able to replicate the same thing with the newly made saw, knife, pick, any sharp metal tool.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

Dont even get me started on the games tendency to be leaning towards realism, and how unrealistic it is a caveman whos discovered alloying and metal bloomeries to not make the correlation between pine resin leaking from scrapes in trees, and being able to replicate the same thing with the newly made saw, knife, pick, any sharp metal tool

Exactly 💯

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We could have different glues for different purposes, with resin just working for nearly every purpose...

 

On 6/17/2022 at 12:05 AM, BenLi said:

1) Evaporating some 20l of milk gives 1 glue

Casein glue isn't too easy to handle, a bit too warm and it's too thin a bit too cold and it's too thick. But it is highly resistant to water, provides a strong bond for a long time, doesn't dry too fast and can be used to glue a widely range of materials.

I'd petition for the additional implementation of tar pits, tar would serve a similar purpose (and have similar properties), but shouldn't be used for things in contact with foods. Tar could be used to make a layer over roads providing a slight additional movement speed boost on it...

Additionally pitch could be cooked from wood and behave like tar for glueing purposes. Pitch burns well, hence pitch filled pits could give us nice eternal fires...

On 6/17/2022 at 12:05 AM, BenLi said:

2) Grinding 10-20 bones, mixing it with 20l of water, then evaporating gives 1 glue

Bone glue is water soluble (and biodegradable) though. And you can extract that collagen use to make it from leather and meat too. From what I gathered quickly it's easy to handle but mostly used for wood (and tapestry, paper,...).

 

On 6/30/2022 at 12:43 AM, Nowweh said:

Or just make it so player grown spruce trees have a chance to spawn resin node.

Or maybe we spawning wild pigs, wild sheep or wild cats (of some bigger sort) a random pine tree near them gets a resin node added to it at ground level or one above. It would give incentive to not light up all your tree farm, even though that does pose the risk of getting wolves (if a wolf spawn was set there at world gen).

 

On 6/30/2022 at 11:21 PM, l33tmaan said:

That second one would be Expanded Foods, since you can also get birch and maple sap the same way.

I always ask myself is it easier to maintain a single mod with many things or several mods with fewer changes each? You mod is huge, though it looks like there shouldn't be too many mods that could interfere negatively...

 

On 7/7/2022 at 3:02 PM, BenLi said:

Resin as for today is one of the bottlenecks/key resources for the game flow - the designers intentionally make it as such for the gamers to play more: you explore the world, you look for resin, you cannot start mechanisms until you have enough resin etc.

Yes and no? If I'm not running through the game half a dozen resin nodes are sufficient to provide one with enough resin over time, if one is really unlucky one can make do with a single node close to ones base, harvested each day there is new resin on it.

On 7/7/2022 at 3:02 PM, BenLi said:

Yet it should be part of vanilla, not mods.

Tbh the devs try to make the stuff not already covered by mods, as that way there is more code for the buck to have. They might implement some mechanics of certain mods at some point, but their focus seems to lie on getting everything that's on the roadmap done in some functional way and adding suggestions not already covered by well functioning mods.

On 7/7/2022 at 3:02 PM, BenLi said:

So it is not about making it easy to get resource. You should not get resin easily. If you want it easy - open creative mode.

That is just rude. Creative mode is not easy mode, easy mode is requesting features to get resources in other ways in vanilla because one is too proud to use other mods (btw the vanilla game content all is mods, try deleting those three mods that come with the installation).

 

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

I highly doubt the devs want the game to be tedious.

One could argue they stated something similar, when asked about the future of crafting...

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

If i make it to even early bronze to late iron, i shouldnt have to spend 4 RL hours searching for resin to make and be creative with windmills and stuff. I just spend 2 RL days searching for iron or tin.

That should not happen, I mean if you searched for iron, you likely needed some resin before, if you were so stupid to fell all the trees that you were able to get resin from, you deserve to search for new nodes, else mark them on your map (you still can fell the parts that are further up) and make your rounds every few days, you can get a decent supply just by that.

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

You absolutely contradict yourself. 
You state the games designed for long play and creativity. No if you wanted that "OpEn CrEaTiVe MoDe"

No, it's not necessarily a contradiction. Long term play can mean every single item has to be hard earned (which seems to be the direction they want the crafting to go in the long run), creativity can mean making the best from what one has. Additionally you are being rude too, which does not help your arguement.

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

Unlocking new tools and tiers of metal should result in the past tedium becoming much easier with new technology.

Yes and no, only because your tool is more durable it does not really make it less tedious to carve out a cellar or anything, you just need fewer repairs. Theoretically those repairs would become harder the harder the metal though. As long as you do not have different tools better suited for the task, you'll mostly only trade the points of tedium at best reduce the sum of tedium slightly.

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

The whole "if you want it easy goto creative" right after stating that the basic experience(which is survival) is supposed to for creativity and leisure play is insane.

people have different definitions for leisure play, I find it really relaxing to just mine and haul every ounce of ore i can find and every other resource from the pit, leaving a huge hollow or an actual strip mine. I like optimizing my mechanism setups and do not see creativity in purely recreating something.

On 7/10/2022 at 1:59 AM, Nowweh said:

Dont even get me started on the games tendency to be leaning towards realism, and how unrealistic it is a caveman whos discovered alloying and metal bloomeries to not make the correlation between pine resin leaking from scrapes in trees, and being able to replicate the same thing with the newly made saw, knife, pick, any sharp metal tool.

You do have some misunderstanding here: Canonically seraphs are no cavemen, they do not "discover" alloying and metal bloomeries, they always knew that and only needed the materials. And it may be that they themselves are not even that intelligent, one of the lore pieces even states that they seem to replicate things they've seen build and they seem to be under control of something else, that might indicate as long as they do not see something scratching a tree and that leading to resin flowing out that they aren't able to make that connection, no matter how obvious it is to you, you are a human Seraphs are explicitly not.

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On 7/1/2022 at 1:12 AM, Maelstrom said:

There's a couple of mods (don't know there names) where one allows creating resin nodes with a knife and the other creates a tree tap to gather sap to boil down to resin.  I think the former makes the game much too easy while the latter seems in line with the developers intent for the game.

Honest I don't want rely on mods just to get an alternate for resin too.

 

But like the OP said, resin can be really easy or very hard to find. And even with that "buff" where we can find more of them likely, I do agree that there should be an alternate.

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