Teh Pizza Lady

I can kind of see where you're coming from...? You can make weapons without smithing (casting or lapping is involved instead). You can still eat without clay making, cooking is probably optional since you can just consume wild fruits and veggies directly.. it makes sense I guess, but given how farming is something that I consider to be required for successful gameplay (flax is required to make some types of bandages, sails for the sailboat, and for the windmill) I am still wary of making it too complex for fear of punishing the casual player. Drifter underwear is just too unreliable a source of flax fibers for me to consider it any sort of viable alternative in any capacity without a mod to increase mob loot drops. However... Smithing *IS* required if you want iron or steel weapons and armor for chapter 2. Claymaking *IS* required if you want iron at all or if you want food to last more than a couple of days before having to throw it out. Cooking *IS* required if you want to have food in the winter. By the same logic, farming is required if you want bandages, sails, etc. Not even for the grains category aspect of eating, but just for basic necessities. Any changes to the current farming system just need to make sense. Random crop death doesn't make sense in this game. There needs to be a reason for it. I'm not saying there isn't, just that it needs to be a good reason outside of adjusting things to match personal preference. That is what mods are for. Outside of environmental changes, if something is already balanced, then rebalancing could introduce unnecessary complexity or even disrupt the existing equilibrium, which several have already pointed out could very well be the case. If players are ignoring something, then it suggest a lack of balance, so it should be adjusted. If new content is introduced, then it could upset established systems which might need adjusting. If a QOL improvement is made, it might unbalance something that would need to be fixed. If the game devs' philosophy changes, then it could prompt a rebalance if the game isn't properly reflecting their vision for it. Lacking those things, the rebalancing of farming is basically useless, because as I've stayed before, it's fine the way it is, not overly complex, not boringly easy. It's a bowl of Baby Bear's porridge. These changes threaten to upset the balance, not fix it.

I appreciate you asking instead of just assuming. Adding complexity doesn't necessarily increase fun. It's been pointed out several times by others that realism does not equate fun in a video game. If the game were realistic, then we wouldn't have temporal storms or drifters or anything else, just about. The landscape wouldn't even be blocks. At some point you have to ask yourself if the added complexity has a point and if the point is purely just to make farming *harder* then the complexity exists for the sole purpose of existing. Anything that exists fore the sole purpose of existing is useless and needs to be trimmed out. If you want less crops then plant less crops or something, lol, idk, but forcing players to spend more of their precious time on something means less time spent elsewhere. Less time spent adventuring, less time spent crossing the wastelands to get to chapter locations, less time spent working on other things that desperately need attention like the forges, or proper food storage so the hard work spent in the fields doesn't go to waste! Complexity for complexity's sake is just bad video game design. EDIT: Bear in mind that this is largely intended to be a single player game with everything being able to be accomplished by a single player. So if you want to be a base mom, then go ahead, but you won't get anything else done in the game.

I’ll only respond to this once, as I’m finding it difficult to approach any conversation with you constructively at the current moment. 'Rebalancing' suggests that something is currently unbalanced. If you can demonstrate that’s the case, I’m open to reconsidering my perspective. As it stands, I believe the balance works well for most players and doesn’t require adjustment. Naturally, any suggestions that disrupt already-balanced systems would be viewed as personal preference rather than an objective need for change. Interpreting this as me invalidating your opinion is your own misinterpretation of what was clearly written. Sorry if that offends you. To avoid further misinterpretations of my words, please give my words justice by reading them carefully before responding. I guarantee you, that I meant precisely and only what I said and nothing else. If there are lines between which to read, don't.

or just increased yields overall, reducing the amount of time even needed to farm for things like grains and veggies.

in order for this to work... Those who do NOT play into the suggested systems shouldn't have their gameplay affected negatively. Like with making steel, you can still use tier 1 refractory bricks, but you'll have to replace them very frequently. By putting in the time and effort to make tier 3 bricks you can skip the brick making phase after a while. An increased effort produces an increased reward (time savings. if the player is rewarded with time, then it is still a reward). You still get the same amount of steel, but you can start making more sooner! By not playing into the brick tier system, you are not punished, but playing into it gives a better reward! How would the suggested system reward the players for the increased effort? Again, NOT playing into the system shouldn't impact players negatively in comparison to how the systems work today. In other words, if this was rolled out into the game now, if I change nothing with how my farms are managed, then I should be able to expect the same harvest as before. Increasing my farming effort should increase my reward either by saving me time later, giving me a bigger harvest or something else that is sure to be useful in the game. I appreciate your candor and willingness to discuss this, but these are questions that should have been answered from the first first post... and weren't. If the person suggesting a thing doesn't give all the information, we can't assume they know what they're talking about!

There is a roadmap. Is this what you were looking for? As for how it fits into the game, there should be a number topics that should be answered: 1. How does this improve the game? 2. What, if any, problems/issues does this fix? 3. What are the drawbacks of this? None is not an acceptable answer, just because having no drawbacks means the idea wasn't well-thought out and means the suggester might not be open to discussing the drawbacks of their Super Amazing Awesome Idea! 4. How does this help players manage their time? 5. How does this affect exploration/story progression? 6. Describe, in detail, how this suggestion should work with the current gameplay mechanics. Unsatisfactory answers should be met with rabble-rousing and pitchforks.

given the subject matter at hand. I believe some well-worded apologies may be in order then. I for one am not sorry for what I said. The way you worded things was just... bad and deserved to be called out. However if you can be civil to others, then my beef with you is ended.

I believe a balanced diet is actually required to maintain satiety between meals. Having a bit of fruits, veggies, grains, dairy, and meat all reduce your need to consume MORE meals as time progresses. So you could certainly have a strict carnivore diet, but you'd need to spend a lot of time hunting or taking care of livestock... which would require even more gathering from wild sources that don't replenish. So having livestock is probably out of the question given that they need to eat a fair bit in order to reproduce. Hunting it is. I guess if you just wanted to eat pots of redmeat stew or bites of charred bushmeat with whatever random foraged bits you could gather tossed in, then by my guest! But it's far from optimal gameplay in that regard. Food is necessary to play the game, unlike other block games we know and have mixed feelings about. Thus the methods of obtaining that food need to be reliable and rewarding for the efforts. Minimal effort should produce minimal reward. Increasing the effort required should substantially increase the reward, but so far none of the OP's posts nor the posts from supporters of the idea have suggested an increased reward for the increased effort -- Strike One. Introducing random crop death reduces the reliability of farming crops -- Strike Two. And honestly the attitude of others who have supported the idea is enough for it to be three strikes against the idea so I'm out. Improve upon the other two strikes and we may have a fair mod suggestion, but I would still be wary of encouraging it to be incorporated into the base game.

Because that is YOUR CHOICE. In my subtext, I said "being forced". If this kind of micromanagement of the base were in the vanilla game, those who do not enjoy that type of gameplay would be turned off by it, no doubt, but if it's a requirement for the playthrough to even succeed, then it needs to be something that can be enjoyed by everyone. CHOOSING to be the base mom is fine. I don't have a problem with that. But like Thorfinn doesn't enjoy chiseling, I don't enjoy base mom-ing. Why should your choice be my default?

Vintage Story really isn't one of those games where you are encourage or even rewarded for fighting the mobs. you earn no experience for doing so you damage or destroy your equipment as you saw mob drops are... disappointing to say the least. the occasional good drop is not worth the hassle of trying to fight them most of the time. If you are having issues with mobs lingering during the day, create a bug report on the github so the devs can see it, but aside from that, yeah it's normal for mobs to come after you. Remember you are in *their* world and they don't like that. Stay indoors or find an activity to do at night that will allow you to be safe..er. Caving is what we do in The Other Block Game. In Vintage Story, to find ores, we prospect with a prospecting pick before digging a hole to find the coveted goods. I would strongly suggest looking into making a prospecting pick to aid in your search of the good stuff so you can stay above the surface where it is safer.

I think the best point against the whole "crops should die if you're gone from your base" thing being a part of vanilla is that the game *encourages* exploration and going out away from your home base. Need to make steel? The materials for those refractory bricks aren't going to bring themselves home... Heck, treasure hunter traders will literally send you ***thousands*** of blocks away from spawn in search of story locations and the game is designed this way to prevent you from accidentally stumbling upon it as you explore... I wonder why they would account for player exploration if the game's design team didn't want people exploring? It just doesn't make sense. The idea is a good one, but it's better suited for a mod or multiplayer gameplay with a dedicated camp mom to oversee everything, tend to the crops, etc while everyone else is off actually enjoying the game. the subtext here is that being forced to stay at the base camp and never explore goes against the game's design and is NOT fun.

Hello! Welcome to the forums @CynAq! Let me be the first to welcome you here! A lot of performance improvements have been made recently so I'm glad you are enjoying the fruits of those labors! There's a little "Wolf Bait" emoji down in the corner. Now I wish it was "Bear Snack"! This is such a comedic new game experience that it reminds me of a time playing a similar block game with a mod that added boars. I cycled through so many different worlds because I thought that boar spawning was tied to the world seed. I'm glad your second world was more forgiving! There are a lot of words that get used interchangeably that perhaps probably shouldn't. This is one such example of that, but a small hurdle to overcome. I really hope you enjoy the story and exploration that this game encourages. There are lots of little things to find hidden in nooks and crannies all around the world.. You just have to be lucky enough to find them! Treasure Hunter traders will become your friend if you enjoy exploring and finding hidden things.

Oh you're giving me credit for that?? oh you..... stahp it...

The ironic part is, you probably weren't looking for an apology to begin with if you thought you had a right to demand the language in which it was made. You cited community fairness and then you were unfair to someone in the community. When someone treats a member unfairly in this community, we all have the duty to stand and encourage fairness among each other whydoesthissoundfamiliar

I wasn't demanding he apologize in a certain way. I was demanding he apologize in a certain way. certified wolf bait

Actually, you know what? I should have read your smarmy reply before posting. I take it all back. You're kind of a pill and I understand why they were criticizing you personally now. You have no right to demand that someone apologizes to you in a certain way. That is emotional abuse and it is not tolerated here.

I know LadyWYT personally... I have no idea who this Thorfinn dude is. He keeps appearing on posts and is probably one of the most knowledgeable people on this game aside from the members of the dev team. He posts often enough that I feel like I can kind of get a bead on his personality however. I would say that neither of them are attacking *you*. They're attacking your knowledge of the game that you're suggesting be altered permanently to fit your vision of the game. Your vision that is, from what I can tell, rather limited because the experience behind it is also limited. It doesn't make your ideas less valid, but it gives them less weight. My advice to you: Finish Chapter 2 and see if you still like this idea or if it makes you want to quit the game. Because honestly if this idea were implemented into the base game, I would probably quit playing until someone modded it out. Why? Tedium. I don't much enjoy TOBG because of it's tedium. I don't enjoy farming in MMORPGs because of the tedium of the grind. Some games introduce it in a fun way that's relevant to the story. Other games just say, "You're playing a MMO game. You will grind. You will like it. Taking shortcuts will be punished harshly." I don't want that kind of gameplay in Vintage Story! Neither does LadyWYT or Thorfinn, two of the most prominent posters on this forum. You should listen to their advice and criticism. Don't take it personally, take it as veterans protecting the game for new players who just want to experience what makes Vintage Story better than other games.

it's completely fair to say that because not everyone wants the idea. Period. That much is evident in this thread. "I want this in my game" does not easily translate into "everyone should have this in their game". That is why people are saying "Make it into a mod then!"

stop giving Tyron ideas...

NOT TO MENTION... MC is written in Java. VS is written in C#. It would be nigh impossible to prove that VS is ripping off MC based on this alone! Different game, different engine, different setup entirely.

I smell something familiar in here... *sniff, sniiifffffff* ... smells like fear.

it's the bandaids flapping in the breeze that giving me the giggles.

great, now I'm imagining a grumpy old man running around naked throwing spears at bears and the mental image is hilarious.

With how few Sawblades there are in the caves I go in, you must be going *really* deep underground to be encountering that many.

I think TOBG is great for kids. My 8-year-old son and I are having a fun playing it together on a *lightly* modded client (just qol mods). When I feel he is old enough for VS I will introduce him to the game. Until then he will have to be content to just watch over my shoulder. In the mean time I will continue to tell him that VS is better and why.