Losing my MIND with my cellars

[Feycat]

I've got 4 rooms that count as "cellars." They're not connected together, they're in three different locations in my large build. All of them are under 7x7x7 and all of them show up green. They are all on the same elevation in the same biome. They're not all being used as cellars, but I've been moving storage vessels around to see why my main cellar isn't working right. 

Storage vessels in the largest one show as .21, two of them of wildly different sizes show as .23 and the one I WAS  using as my main cellar is suddenly showing .34. I have no idea why. It's 7x7x3 tall. The floor, ceiling and walls are entirely stone blocks. I even added a fireclay door, when all the others have wooden doors and I STILL can't get it past .34

What's going on?

(BTW just a heads up, wallpaper makes your cellar less efficient. When I had wallpaper up it was .45!

[regex]

Cellars can definitely be weird. How is the access to these rooms? Are they exposed to natural light? The best cellars I've had were carefully protected from natural light, I'd suggest placing some hay blocks in front of the doors and seeing if they equalize.

[CastIronFabric]

50 minutes ago, Feycat said:

I've got 4 rooms that count as "cellars." They're not connected together, they're in three different locations in my large build. All of them are under 7x7x7 and all of them show up green. They are all on the same elevation in the same biome. They're not all being used as cellars, but I've been moving storage vessels around to see why my main cellar isn't working right. 

Storage vessels in the largest one show as .21, two of them of wildly different sizes show as .23 and the one I WAS  using as my main cellar is suddenly showing .34. I have no idea why. It's 7x7x3 tall. The floor, ceiling and walls are entirely stone blocks. I even added a fireclay door, when all the others have wooden doors and I STILL can't get it past .34

What's going on?

(BTW just a heads up, wallpaper makes your cellar less efficient. When I had wallpaper up it was .45!

I assume the decimal numbers you are giving are related to the spoilage rate.

From my understanding, all doors can leak light and light does affect. I have not tested this and I have heard contradictions on that but from my understanding the best set up is a hallway making an L with two doors one for the hallway access and the other door for the cellar room.

I should test that but I havent, I just like that set up anyway so I just do it without having tested it really.

[LadyWYT]

1 hour ago, Feycat said:

I even added a fireclay door, when all the others have wooden doors

I betcha the firebrick door is the problem. Try putting a wooden door on it and see if that fixes things.

[Feycat]

1 hour ago, LadyWYT said:

I betcha the firebrick door is the problem. Try putting a wooden door on it and see if that fixes things.

I changed TO the firebrick door and it got fractionally better! It originally had a wooden door, as all the others do. 

 

2 hours ago, CastIronFabric said:

I assume the decimal numbers you are giving are related to the spoilage rate.

From my understanding, all doors can leak light and light does affect. I have not tested this and I have heard contradictions on that but from my understanding the best set up is a hallway making an L with two doors one for the hallway access and the other door for the cellar room.

I should test that but I havent, I just like that set up anyway so I just do it without having tested it really.

Yes, the spoilage rate is based on a ceramic vessel placed in each room.

Literally all four cellars are one stone room with one wooden door facing the outside world. None of them are nested in any way. I just can't figure out why they're all so different.

[Feycat]

2 hours ago, regex said:

Cellars can definitely be weird. How is the access to these rooms? Are they exposed to natural light? The best cellars I've had were carefully protected from natural light, I'd suggest placing some hay blocks in front of the doors and seeing if they equalize.

All four are a single square room with one wooden door that faces outdoors. They all have one wall shared with the outdoors, other three walls are facing pure undergrouind

[Vexxvididu]

16 hours ago, Feycat said:

I've got 4 rooms that count as "cellars." They're not connected together, they're in three different locations in my large build. All of them are under 7x7x7 and all of them show up green. They are all on the same elevation in the same biome. They're not all being used as cellars, but I've been moving storage vessels around to see why my main cellar isn't working right. 

Storage vessels in the largest one show as .21, two of them of wildly different sizes show as .23 and the one I WAS  using as my main cellar is suddenly showing .34. I have no idea why. It's 7x7x3 tall. The floor, ceiling and walls are entirely stone blocks. I even added a fireclay door, when all the others have wooden doors and I STILL can't get it past .34

What's going on?

(BTW just a heads up, wallpaper makes your cellar less efficient. When I had wallpaper up it was .45!

 

Do you have any other wood or decretive blocks in your cellar after removing the wallpaper?  Ideally cellars are just dirt and stone walls.  I even use just dirt blocks as the door since it is better than wood.  I think the only wood items you won't get penalized for in the cellar are shelves and chests (and maybe other storage items).

A screen shot of your cellar might really help to spot anything amiss.

[jerjerje]

The outside temperature also influences the spoilage rate in cellars. For example, in winter the spoilage rate will be much lower.

There are also (small) temperature differences, even among small distances. (Even only travelling east to west). These differences are only slight, but they might cause the differences you see in the spoilage rate. Going higher significantly affects temperature, so keep that in mind too.

If you want to test this, you could use the command: 

/wgen pos climate

This gives you an output like this:

Temperature: 18,5°C, Year avg: 3,5°C, Avg. Rainfall: 53%, Geologic Activity: 10%, Fertility: 37%, Forest: 0%,
Shrub: 39%, Sealevel dist: 43%, Season: Summer, Hemisphere: North

The important value here is the "Year avg". This is the average temperature at that spot. Go to your cellars and see how this differs between them. I would assume the cellars with lower perish rate are in slightly colder areas.

I'm not sure if this is what's causing the difference, but it's worth testing.

[CastIronFabric]

3 minutes ago, jerjerje said:

The outside temperature also influences the spoilage rate in cellars. For example, in winter the spoilage rate will be much lower.

There are also (small) temperature differences, even among small distances. (Even only travelling east to west). These differences are only slight, but they might cause the differences you see in the spoilage rate. Going higher significantly affects temperature, so keep that in mind too.

If you want to test this, you could use the command: 

/wgen pos climate

This gives you an output like this:

Temperature: 18,5°C, Year avg: 3,5°C, Avg. Rainfall: 53%, Geologic Activity: 10%, Fertility: 37%, Forest: 0%,
Shrub: 39%, Sealevel dist: 43%, Season: Summer, Hemisphere: North

The important value here is the "Year avg". This is the average temperature at that spot. Go to your cellars and see how this differs between them. I would assume the cellars with lower perish rate are in slightly colder areas.

I'm not sure if this is what's causing the difference, but it's worth testing.

its different per room in the exact same location though so.

[jerjerje]

13 minutes ago, CastIronFabric said:

its different per room in the exact same location though so.

Well, the temperature does also change with the time of day and season. That can cause the spoilage rates to change over time.

I believe open doors and open trapdoors also affect the spoilage rate.

[marmarmar34]

16 minutes ago, jerjerje said:

Well, the temperature does also change with the time of day and season. That can cause the spoilage rates to change over time.

I believe open doors and open trapdoors also affect the spoilage rate.

I believe temperature spoilage rate isn't factored into the container's shown spoilage rate, just on what bonuses the room provides.

@OP I'd suggest putting all of your cellars a couple blocks underground. It may help with your strange room behaviors. 

[CastIronFabric]

32 minutes ago, jerjerje said:

Well, the temperature does also change with the time of day and season. That can cause the spoilage rates to change over time.

I believe open doors and open trapdoors also affect the spoilage rate.

the temperature is not going to change 32 blocks away from each other, unless you just happened to be in some very unique edge of a temperature zone that just happens to have a dramatic difference within 32 blocks which is not impossible but likely not the deal here.

Edited January 18 by CastIronFabric

[williams_482]

I have a cellar where milk spoils slightly faster in one corner and slightly slower in the opposite corner. The only plausible explanation I can come up with is that one corner of the room is in a slightly cooler region than the other. 

[regex]

17 minutes ago, williams_482 said:

I have a cellar where milk spoils slightly faster in one corner and slightly slower in the opposite corner. The only plausible explanation I can come up with is that one corner of the room is in a slightly cooler region than the other. 

Without seeing it, I'd guess it's likely due to sunlight exposure. Spoilage rates in my cellar are lower further from the door. The wiki notes that doors do not block light (open or closed) and this has been my experience.

Edited January 18 by regex

[williams_482]

56 minutes ago, regex said:

Without seeing it, I'd guess it's likely due to sunlight exposure. Spoilage rates in my cellar are lower further from the door. The wiki notes that doors do not block light (open or closed) and this has been my experience.

That does seem a more likely explanation. The lowest spoilage zone is the wall opposite the door, and the structure is above ground. 

[regex]

2 minutes ago, williams_482 said:

That does seem a more likely explanation.

After messing around in creative I don't know if that's entirely an accurate thing, really starting to doubt the wiki.

I usually build 5x5x3 underground (roof at surface level) cellars and in my survival world I see this difference in spoilage rates, but building an above-ground cellar in creative (same world settings as my survival) with a long covered hallway to the door which allows fine light control, I don't see these rate differences. I opened the hallway at a point where half the room was in pitch black and the spoilage rates are the same.

That being said, when I checked the spoilage rates in my survival world it was the height of summer heading into autumn, so temperature was probably a much bigger factor (note that cellars only lower the ambient temperature, they don't set it) and the difference showed up. The creative world is current in spring. It doesn't seem to matter much in the dead of winter.

Maybe it's not sunlight (that does seem to be an overall factor just from creative testing, but not a big one) but the differences in temperature across the room?

[Feycat]

3 hours ago, marmarmar34 said:

I believe temperature spoilage rate isn't factored into the container's shown spoilage rate, just on what bonuses the room provides.

@OP I'd suggest putting all of your cellars a couple blocks underground. It may help with your strange room behaviors. 

They are all underground with the exception of the single wall that borders outdoors.

3 hours ago, jerjerje said:

The outside temperature also influences the spoilage rate in cellars. For example, in winter the spoilage rate will be much lower.

There are also (small) temperature differences, even among small distances. (Even only travelling east to west). These differences are only slight, but they might cause the differences you see in the spoilage rate. Going higher significantly affects temperature, so keep that in mind too.

If you want to test this, you could use the command: 

/wgen pos climate

This gives you an output like this:

Temperature: 18,5°C, Year avg: 3,5°C, Avg. Rainfall: 53%, Geologic Activity: 10%, Fertility: 37%, Forest: 0%,
Shrub: 39%, Sealevel dist: 43%, Season: Summer, Hemisphere: North

The important value here is the "Year avg". This is the average temperature at that spot. Go to your cellars and see how this differs between them. I would assume the cellars with lower perish rate are in slightly colder areas.

I'm not sure if this is what's causing the difference, but it's worth testing.

I'm in a hot climate desert. The problem is that there's such a stark different between the rooms. I'm storing crocks in my translocator room because it's .2 better than my cellar! 

Also I built an extra wall between outside and the misbehaving cellar, so it has 3 walls fully underground, a 2-block thick ceiling (which matches all the others) AND a 2 block thick wall between it and outside. It didn't change anything. Still .4

[CosmosLordJura]

I'd make sure you don't have wooden blocks as building blocks for the actual cellar walls and floor since they increase the spoilage rate. Also, make sure you always have the door shut on the cellar since an open door increases the spoilage rate compared to a closed one.