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Vintage Story on CurseForge?


Do you want CurseForge to offer mod hosting for VS?  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you want CurseForge to offer mod hosting for VS?

    • Yep
      11
    • Nope
      7

This poll is closed to new votes


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A lot of it is down to business strategy. If the developers want to keep it as a largely indie project then fine. The biggest thing you get with CurseForge is instant access to tens of millions of avid gamers. Millions of dedicated MC players looking for something different, but intuitive. Millions of Blizzard Games players looking for new experiences, new games, and new challenges. Tens of millions of potential sales. So much so that even if you looked at a 0.5% resolution into actual sales, the game would overtake many major releases in terms of new users. With CurseForge, you stand shoulder to shoulder with not only the game's largest competitor, but also one of the largest gaming markets, on the world's largest gaming livestreaming platform, at the very time where Twitch are taking over from YouTube as a general social gaming platform. Especially for early access games.

Allowing manual modding, but also integrating into CurseForge would be possible. Launch the game onto the world stage, and reap the rewards in terms of sales, popularity, and interest, but those who still want to unzip files into folders can also do their thing. Twitch allows for this, for instance, Optifine wasn't included in any packs, and wasn't available on CurseForge, and yet it was, and still is, an absolute essential mod for the game. You manually downloaded it from their site, and stick the file in the correct folder. Before that, you had to rename the jar, unzip it, patch it, repack it, rename it back to jar, and cross your fingers. And yet it was still an essential mod.

You could create a bespoke mod manager, that looks and feels almost exactly like the Twitch Launcher, but without the ridiculously huge benefits to business management, and add it into the patch notes for the next release of the game. Those who read the patch notes and announcements on this forum would know, but beyond that, the game hasn't grown, and from a business management point of view, you've lost a massive opportunity to expand your user base. The potential ROI alone is enough to make this a no-brainer. There's also nothing stopping you doing both. Twitch exists. MultiMC exists. CurseForge exists. Optifine.net exists. Drama aside, there's plenty of choice, and if players want to manually add files to folders, and keep checking websites for potential updates that they have to manually download and place in the correct folder... let them. However, for the vast majority of the user base, including the millions of potential customers you'd get from joining CurseForge, being able to search for, install, and launch packs from Twitch is the absolute minimum they'd expect, and the game will suffer as it grows without it.

The launcher would essentially just give command line arguments to the game as it loads, to tell it which world to load. Once you're in the game, there's nothing stopping you from logging out of that world, and into another that uses the same version of the game. Twitch doesn't care what you do once the game is open. If the game allows you to log out of one world and into another, than brilliant. Nothing will change with that regard. What will change though, is the mod and modpack discovery, version control, and management. I don't know how load order is currently handled within VS, but if it is handled at runtime, by the game, nothing will change with that either. At the moment, I can see no real downside about joining CurseForge. It doesn't lock you in, you get instant access to tens of millions of potential customers, and it pushes first line tech support off site. At the same time, the devteam could work on a "MultiVS" clone for anyone who wants to do things manually.

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If this were my company, I'd want to invest some time and money into research on this. And I'd want to do it FAST. Over the next few months, a lot of gamers are going to have a lot of time on their hands, and online gaming is going to sky rocket. I'd hire a financial adviser who's well versed in the gaming industry, to run the numbers on market forecasts in different scenarios. Looking at potential user bases of various platforms. Steam, CurseForge, GOG, Nexus, in-house, community driven. This is, first and foremost, and business management decision, and right now, over the next couple of weeks, is the best time to jump on it as hard as possible, and push the game as far as it can go.

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40 minutes ago, ApacheTech said:

A lot of it is down to business strategy. If the developers want to keep it as a largely indie project then fine. The biggest thing you get with CurseForge is instant access to tens of millions of avid gamers. Millions of dedicated MC players looking for something different, but intuitive. Millions of Blizzard Games players looking for new experiences, new games, and new challenges. Tens of millions of potential sales. So much so that even if you looked at a 0.5% resolution into actual sales, the game would overtake many major releases in terms of new users. With CurseForge, you stand shoulder to shoulder with not only the game's largest competitor, but also one of the largest gaming markets, on the world's largest gaming livestreaming platform, at the very time where Twitch are taking over from YouTube as a general social gaming platform. Especially for early access games.

CurseForge support alone won't generate any new sales nor awareness, they aren't doing free advertisement. And integrating into the Twitch Launcher on the same level as Minecraft might not be as easy as it sounds. And it won't provide features, like auto-download of mods on joining a modded server, which I would personally rank much higher than third party one-click-install services.

The most user and modder friendly way will therefore always be to offer first party mod management directly integrated in the game maybe with support for a variety third party mod hosting services. First party hosting would probably also be very nice, like with Factorio, but comes with additional work and costs.

However, at the current point in time where there are only very few mods available for Vintage Story, it generally isn't worth it to put so much effort into a feature only very few people will use.

Edited by Erik
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As with so many things at the moment, the best thing to do is... Don't do one thing, do it all. Twitch Launcher is the big point of sale. CurseForge is the fully integrated mod hub, and a bespoke mod launcher will satisfy the die-hards. But again, from a business management point of view, if you have to coerce the die-hards to use efficient means of mod management in the same way that average users do, in order to cut down the maintenance of disparate first-party apps, then so be it. Just ship the first-party app as open source, and let the community take it over. If the few users that demand manual control take it up, then brilliant, but if it falls by the wayside, it was superfluous anyway.

Edited by ApacheTech
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6 minutes ago, ApacheTech said:

As with so many things at the moment, the best thing to do is... Don't do one thing, do it all.

Only true if time and monetary restrictions are not a thing.

6 minutes ago, ApacheTech said:

Twitch Launcher is the big point of sale.

Nope, mods are a big sales point. Easy installation is just a bonus. And currently there just aren't many mods available.

I'm not against CurseForge support, I think it's not a bad idea, as it provides free hosting and easy installation for mods. But making it out to be a "must-have" and a "valuable business decision" that has to be done "right now" is just plain false. Right now, new features and extentions/reworks of existing game systems is what the game would benefit most from, long term. When there are a few more mods available, it may be time to think about mod hosting and installation.

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I have a question, why couldn't you do both? Have a native launcher like we have now, have the mods still on the forums and still have a base on curse? I'm new to everything here, but reading others comments and arguments, I don't see why you just couldn't have both up and meet everyone in the middle. I keep reading this is better than that and that's better than this but with mods on both the forums and curse as well as the native launcher and curse launcher.

The only issue I see is that people 'may' stop coming to the forums over time like you see in MC. Other options have been put out that would do the same. I'm fine with coming here, just wish there was an easier "lazier" way to see when mods updated. (I still play vanilla).

Just a thought.

Thanks to everyone for everything you do!

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8 minutes ago, Erik said:

I'm not against CurseForge support, I think it's not a bad idea, as it provides free hosting and easy installation for mods. But making it out to be a "must-have" and a "valuable business decision" that has to be done "right now" is just plain false. Right now, new features and extentions/reworks of existing game systems is what the game would benefit most from, long term. When there are a few more mods available, it may be time to think about mod hosting and installation.

My point with that is that right now, the world is in a unique position. The market for new users has just opened up massively. The next few months will see a huge rise in online gaming, as people are forced, sometimes by law, to stay at home. Quality of life mods for new games will be the first thing to see an up-surgence. Consumer business logic dictates that the game should follow the path of least resistance. In a normal world, yes this could be a decision that we could ponder for another two years after the thread was initially started, but this is not a normal time. As for monetary restrictions, the Capex costs of joining CurseForge and Twitch Launcher are far lower than developing a fully featured mod manager, and website from scratch, and the Opex costs are more fully covered by the ROI of joining.

Just now, whiskeyAF said:

I have a question, why couldn't you do both?

You can. If this is added to CurseForge, and the Twitch Launcher, nothing stops anyone from manually downloading mods from anywhere online, and adding them to the correct folder. Nothing even stops any modder, or team of modders creating a MultiVS style mod manager.

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  • Tyron unpinned this topic

I’ve been (forced) to use Curseforge for years for MC mods and Nexus for all Elder Scrolls games and I really can’t understand, why people prefer Curse over Nexus. No idea of mod maker viewpoint, as I never uploaded anything, but from user viewpoint it was always a lot easier to keep track of your mods in Nexus. What has an update, version patchnotes etc. Of course, Curse offered it too, just you always had to click more to have same info. Curse might have have fake better look in first glance, but for useability, I really don’t like it, so seeing it as popular vote here really confuses me.

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I used to use Nexus Mod Manager for Skyrim, but it wasn't updated for donkeys years, and so fell out of favour. For modpack makers on CurseForge, it was ridiculously easy to manage the packs. Create the pack exactly how you want it in the Twitch Launcher, and then just export it to CurseForge, and you're done. Then, CurseForge automatically takes care of versioning for all the mods in the pack, and whenever you update a new version of your pack, everything is linked automatically. I haven't used this new Vortex thing from Nexus, but it's good to see they've finally got round to replacing NMM. Again, the biggest thing is footfall. Steam Workshop is obviously the ultimate for footfall, but Curse is definitely second, with Nexus being a distant third.

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  • 2 months later...

Late to the party but I still feel I have a couple valid things. Curseforge was just acquired by Overwolf and as a CurseForge content creator, this has pushed me away. Overwolf said they have changed their practices from the past and are GDPR compliant but still not excited about them having my PII (personal Identifiable Information). They mine a lot of data from you (some you can opt out of) and a lot of it is for targeted adds that will be added to the Overwolf/CurseForge app. This merger made me decide to try Vintage Story as an alternative to modded Minecraft.

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I don't know about anyone else, is copy/paste into a "mods" folder that difficult that we need 3rd party software to do it for us?

Not used CurseForge, doesn't it only run on Windows anyway, but is there the chance of it helping advertise the game by being there? If so that could be a more valid reason than mod hosting really.

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2 hours ago, Korhaka said:

I don't know about anyone else, is copy/paste into a "mods" folder that difficult that we need 3rd party software to do it for us?

Not used CurseForge, doesn't it only run on Windows anyway, but is there the chance of it helping advertise the game by being there? If so that could be a more valid reason than mod hosting really.

I agree though as good as this game is, it doesn't need forge to get attention. A few youtubers are already playing it like mischief of mice and I think the right places to advertise and a few changes to non ig features will draw audiences. For example, if the modding section had its own page with searchable functionality then you are good.

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Installing mods can never be too easy imo.

The best implementation I've seen so far is in OpenTTD, it has a built-in system that's really convenient and simple. (At least for the end user, I've never looked at the creator side there)

If you want to play with mods in singleplayer or for your own server you can search/apply mods from within the game client, it supports collections you can easily switch between. When you load a savegame it'll automatically use whatever that game was started with without messing with your other settings. When you join a server it'll tell you exactly which mods you're missing for it and lets you download them all with a single click.

Easy to use, no technical knowledge or annoying manual steps required, no headaches with manually having to use the right combination for existing saves (Cough, steamworkshop, cough) or other headaches that usually come with modded content.

And if for whatever reason the content isn't on their main repository the game supports local content just fine, drop it in a folder and itll integrate with the regular system without any issues.

 

 

 

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  • 5 months later...
  • 2 weeks later...

i say no to CurseForge. (no Linux support, Amazon company binding/Twitch)

maybe use git or https://gitea.io/ on you own server an make an InGame Mod-Manger that download it from the own hosted gitea server when joining on a server or maybe in an Launcher?

maybe you add to the gitea server all users from the forum

btw curse use git

Edited by Lucy Demoon
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14 minutes ago, Lucy Demoon said:

i say no to CurseForge. (no Linux support, Amazon company binding/Twitch)

maybe use git or https://gitea.io/ on you own server an make an InGame Mod-Manger that download it from the own hosted gitea server when joining on a server or maybe in an Launcher?

maybe you add to the gitea server all users from the forum

btw curse use git

CurseForge is no longer owned by Amazon/Twitch, it was sold to Overwolf

But anyway, it still doesn't support Linux.  Overwolf apps aren't on Linux either

Edited by DArkHekRoMaNT
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