Borax/Lime/Chalk/Marble for leather is waaaaaaay too hard to find.

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

There's a very simple fix that I can't believe hasn't been added to the game yet: Panning for shellfish and mollusks so you can grind their shells into Lime. I feel like it's absolutely required, because there's a meter that looks something like this <---------> where on the left you have spawn RNG and on the right you have "I found it because I looked for it" and honestly, lime is currently way too far on the left side of that meter. Had an 11 hour livestream today and found no borax, despite the fact that I spent 6 hours walking in every direction long enough to find new stone layers. Found slate in one direction. Found Peridotite in another. Granite everywhere else. Then I finally find some sandstone, and I use the prospecting pick for an hour and find nothing. It's stupid, it's annoying, it's demoralizing, and we need an alternative to be added to the game. Panning for shellfish and mollusks is the absolute easiest way to solve this glaring issue with the game's progression. I don't want to hear a bunch of people say "HUFF PUFF, WELL, I LIKE IT THE WAY IT IS, SO THERE." It is painfully objectively obvious to literally everybody with two brain cells to rub together that we need an alternative means of creating lime because some spawns just have flat-out none. I'm playing without a map, so I can't just go on long ten year excursions to find a rock. I need to travel in straight lines, build waypoints, and always remember where my home - or at least the road back to my home - is. Panning for shellfish and mollusks is literally a no-brainer, and they should be common enough to the point where it's a lot like finding copper nuggets. 1 in 6. Perfect. You want to pan for 25 shellfish? Go for it, that's a barrel of Lime. It's perfect. The ultimate solution for those who lack the spawn RNG currently required to find it in the present state of the game. I don't even need to plead my case, the simple fact that I know how to find lime and I spent 11 hours failing to find it during a livestream is proof enough of my claim. It's beyond refute, and I'm too frustrated to hear anybody complain about how correct I am, or worse, about how wrong they falsely believe me to be.

Edited December 5, 2025 by Discipline Before Dishonor

[dakko]

Your playstyle/desires sound well-suited to Limestone from Caves, which causes stalactites and stalacmites to drop limestone.

[LadyWYT]

2 minutes ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

It is painfully objectively obvious to literally everybody with two brain cells to rub together that we need another alternative means of creating lime because some spawns just have flat-out none.

I will note that players aren't guaranteed to find absolutely everything they need for progression within a day's walk of the world spawn. There are seeds like that, but most of the time there's going to be a couple of resources that the player will need to spend some time searching for.

In the case of limestone and chalk, when those rocks appear, there's a LOT of them. Borax can spawn in pretty much any sediment rock, I believe, so even if there's no lime or chalk nearby, there's still a decent workaround.

Now don't get me wrong, I do think that shells would be a good addition to the panning loot tables as a semi-rare loot drop. However, it's also worth noting that there's already another alternative to looking for shells, if one cannot otherwise find lime/chalk/borax, and that is traders. Survival Goods and Commodities traders both sell lime, I do believe, for a quite reasonable price. Provided one is playing with lore content enabled, it's not terribly hard to do some wheeling and dealing when necessary.

9 minutes ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

You want to pan for 50 shellfish? Go for it, that's a barrel of Lime.

Two barrels of limewater, actually. Each shell grinds into two lime.

 

10 minutes ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

The ultimate solution for those who lack the spawn RNG to find it.

I will note that there are mods that offer solutions to this(such as the one @dakko mentioned), if one finds it a problem. And mods do not change the game for everyone else.

Also worth noting that what's been proposed above only solves potential supply issues for leatherworking, plaster, and mortar components. Borax is still going to be an issue for the late game, as it's a mandatory resource for moving past iron.

[Maelstrom]

If only lime could be used as a welding flux.

[Teh Pizza Lady]

38 minutes ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

I don't want to hear a bunch of people say "HUFF PUFF, WELL, I LIKE IT THE WAY IT IS, SO THERE."

You're making this very tempting......painfully so.

You play Vintage Story. This is your life now.

[dakko]

28 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

I do think that shells would be a good addition to the panning loot tables as a semi-rare loot drop.

A rare loot drop would be okay, imo, but they've already made it much easier to find shells in the wild. Or perhaps I've had incredibly good luck.

I just don't see the need to provide nearly instant gratification to everyone just because one player decides to play without a map, thereby forfeiting the ability to quickly find bodies of water.

[LadyWYT]

51 minutes ago, dakko said:

A rare loot drop would be okay, imo, but they've already made it much easier to find shells in the wild. Or perhaps I've had incredibly good luck.

Probably some good luck, in that regard. On the loot drops from panning, I'm thinking less in terms of useful resources, and more in terms of fueling my shell-hunting addiction. 

[Teh Pizza Lady]

1 hour ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

It's beyond refute, and I'm too frustrated to hear anybody complain about how correct I am, or worse, about how wrong they falsely believe me to be.

RNG is a cruel mistress and we are all bound to her will.

Your seed sucks for Lime. End of story. I've been screwed over by Bauxite before. My current map has it EVERYWHERE, but I cannot find Olivine anywhere. Borax was literally on top of the surface for me and there's an entire limestone/chalk beach across the ocean from me. My seed sucks for Olivine. It's a struggle. Welcome to Vintage Story. This is your life now!

Try a different seed or keep looking for other sources. You'll get there!

[dakko]

5 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

Probably some good luck, in that regard. On the loot drops from panning, I'm thinking less in terms of useful resources, and more in terms of fueling my shell-hunting addiction. 

I'm the same with shell-hunting!  I started a new game last night in 1.21.5 and found 7 shells within the first 2 hours of gameplay (3 were in a cluster though).

[Venusgate]

20 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

Probably some good luck, in that regard. On the loot drops from panning, I'm thinking less in terms of useful resources, and more in terms of fueling my shell-hunting addiction. 

I think this is what tips it for me. 

Having a laborious way to get your first batch of leather going is good. Having a late-game gatchapa for seashells is also good.

[Krougal]

Part of the Borax problem can be solved with a simple mod:

https://mods.vintagestory.at/morefluxes

 

[Vexxvididu]

4 hours ago, Teh Pizza Lady said:

RNG is a cruel mistress and we are all bound to her will.

Your seed sucks for Lime. End of story. I've been screwed over by Bauxite before. My current map has it EVERYWHERE, but I cannot find Olivine anywhere. Borax was literally on top of the surface for me and there's an entire limestone/chalk beach across the ocean from me. My seed sucks for Olivine. It's a struggle. Welcome to Vintage Story. This is your life now!

Try a different seed or keep looking for other sources. You'll get there!

I do think there is a bit too much "variance" in resource availability in VS.  I'm sure it's possible to tweak the world generation so that there is just a bit more consistency...  But I also know that's likely easier said than done.  But yes, as @LadyWYT said, most worlds will grant some things easily and other things not at all.  I'm currently struggling to find lead and bauxite.  I've also had no luck with bees.

[Teh Pizza Lady]

3 minutes ago, Vexxvididu said:

I do think there is a bit too much "variance" in resource availability in VS.  I'm sure it's possible to tweak the world generation so that there is just a bit more consistency...  But I also know that's likely easier said than done.  But yes, as @LadyWYT said, most worlds will grant some things easily and other things not at all.  I'm currently struggling to find lead and bauxite.  I've also had no luck with bees.

I had to travel a days trip by boat to find bees in my last world. It was painful.

[Maelstrom]

4 hours ago, Teh Pizza Lady said:

I had to travel a days trip by boat to find bees in my last world. It was painful.

In my first serious playthrough I had a 2,000 block run to the second nearest bee.   Why second nearest you ask?   Coz I inadvertently and totally unintentionally despawned the hive that was just 100 blocks from my home.  Later I chopped down some bothersome tall pine trees about 50 blocks from home and (I think you see where I'm going here).  Well, I was quite surprised when 3 honeycomb appeared in my hotbar.

Yeeeeaaaahhhh...   I need to check the Humorous Stories thread to see if I told that one.

[Maelstrom]

Just got back from the Humorous Stories thread.

Yeah, the bee story is there already.   But it was 3,000 blocks, not 2,000.

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

11 hours ago, dakko said:

A rare loot drop would be okay, imo, but they've already made it much easier to find shells in the wild. Or perhaps I've had incredibly good luck.

I just don't see the need to provide nearly instant gratification to everyone just because one player decides to play without a map, thereby forfeiting the ability to quickly find bodies of water.

Instant gratification my ass

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

Is there a world setting that governs "biome size" or something, where it would make rock layers have more variance? Something to change before setting up the world? Bees have driven me crazy before, I literally had a world where there wasn't a single forgetmenot or daisy for what seemed like hundreds of miles, I literally quit that world because I couldn't even find a forest suited to bee generation lol. Apparently those flowers, along with specific trees indicate bee viability, but if you don't see those flowers, they can't spawn there

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

12 hours ago, dakko said:

Your playstyle/desires sound well-suited to Limestone from Caves, which causes stalactites and stalacmites to drop limestone.

I just wish I had more information like how much limestone dropped per stalactite, but I suppose I could just install it and go on creative to test it out. Thank you for the recommendation 

Edited December 6, 2025 by Discipline Before Dishonor

[Discipline Before Dishonor]

I ended up downloading the "BetterProspecting" mod which allowed me to use the Prospector's Pick to search in a radius around me for stone types, within something like 150 blocks of me. Found pink marble in about 5 minutes with it, problem SOLVED! Mind you, I was looking in an area with Sandstone which I had to travel kilometers to reach, couldn't have found the marble otherwise. But now, if I travel to a place with Conglomerate, Sandstone, Claystone, etc, I can use the prospector's pick to find a stone type that grinds into lime. It's fair progression now, and not nearly as aimless and painful 

Edited December 6, 2025 by Discipline Before Dishonor

[Mowdan]

I need a source of lime too but it is winter and I don't want to go too far out. Not sure how I even look for it, is it just on the surface or do you need to did past some rock? Does opening more mine shafts give you a chance to find? Or do you just travel out to see it on the surface?

[CastIronFabric]

I agree with the OP and yes I have been known to delete and restart a game if I can not find limestone or chalk. Actually the way I play now is just to start flying on day 1 until I find the right spot for me. I am not investing 200 hours in a location that I do not really care much for, nope no more of that.

Edited December 6, 2025 by CastIronFabric

[LadyWYT]

6 hours ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

I just wish I had more information like how much limestone dropped per stalactite, but I suppose I could just install it and go on creative to test it out. Thank you for the recommendation 

If that one isn't your fancy, you might try out Ancient Tools. It adds a different leatherworking option that does not require lime or tannin, plus several other fun little things.

https://mods.vintagestory.at/ancienttools

7 hours ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

Is there a world setting that governs "biome size" or something, where it would make rock layers have more variance? Something to change before setting up the world?

Yes and no. Landform Scale governs the size of mountains, plains, and other features. Biomes are a lot trickier though, as they're governed by latitude, temperature, rainfall, and forest coverage. I don't think there's really a way to make them bigger, as much as there are ways to make certain climates more prominent.

 

7 hours ago, Discipline Before Dishonor said:

Bees have driven me crazy before, I literally had a world where there wasn't a single forgetmenot or daisy for what seemed like hundreds of miles, I literally quit that world because I couldn't even find a forest suited to bee generation lol. Apparently those flowers, along with specific trees indicate bee viability, but if you don't see those flowers, they can't spawn there

To my knowledge, bees just require a warmish climate without too much rainfall in order to spawn, as well as a tree or something to spawn in. The flower type doesn't matter--the plant just needs to count as a flower in order for the bees to use it. 

If you're having trouble locating bees, the Buzzwords mod can help you find them. https://mods.vintagestory.at/buzzwords

[Zane Mordien]

14 hours ago, Teh Pizza Lady said:

I had to travel a days trip by boat to find bees in my last world. It was painful.

I traveled 2 days in one playthrough for bees then I logged back into that world a year latter to check out my old world and found bees in the first tree 200 blocks from my base.

[Zane Mordien]

1 hour ago, CastIronFabric said:

I agree with the OP and yes I have been known to delete and restart a game if I can not find limestone or chalk. Actually the way I play now is just to start flying on day 1 until I find the right spot for me. I am not investing 200 hours in a location that I do not really care much for, nope no more of that.

I've started doing the same with base locations.  I just dont want the hassle of a mountain or rugged hill spawn anymore. Been there done that, not interested in doing it again.

[Zane Mordien]

21 minutes ago, LadyWYT said:

 

If you're having trouble locating bees, the Buzzwords mod can help you find them. https://mods.vintagestory.at/buzzwords

@Discipline Before Dishonor I had so much frustrations with finding bees at first. Nowadays I find them all the time with no issues. 

IMO the first thing they should do to find bees is turn off the music and put on headphones. Also avoid pine trees. If they spawn in pine trees I've never seen it.